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Author Topic: NASA 37mm Restrictor Plates - READY TO ORDER
Cliffy Chains
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I am bored at work, so thought I would "Stir" [Big Grin]

This rule change that Nasa has done IMO is genius, it attracts all the NA type cars, seeing how most everyone complains in SCCA the 99's are too much to handle for the normal drivers. This I feel will attract alot of the SCCA NA owners to the Nasa battle grounds in 2011. [thumbsup]

"Stir some more" The high caliber of driver that are usually in the 99' cars, will probably show up with their 1.6 or their 1.8 cars in tote, thus not changing the view on the podium for the most part, only the view in Impound. [Eek!]

This plate change has tempted alot of drivers to rethink their schedules for 2011, me included. Not because I can run against Nasa competitors, but a field that I think will mostly be contested by the NA cars.

"A little seasoning with the stir" So at the next event I will pack up my poor, power deprived, 1.6 and arrive with all intentions of seeing alot of familiar faces in unfamiliar cars. [fight]
I think the job the SCCA has done with parity is the closest it has been since I started, yet all the "high caliber" drivers seem to be in their 99's??? I also think Nasa's approach, in the end, will have us even closer, come sept, than ever before. [twocents]

--------------------
BDR Motorsports, Autotechnik
Cliff Blanchard
Down on power 1.6
Sluggish overweight 99'

Tom Sager Made Donation to Website
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I think the thread is way off course and you guys have it all wrong. It started by simply announcing that the 37mm plates were available for $30. I think the problem is the price. It's too high. How do you justify the same price for 37mm as for 47mm? If they drop the price to $20, they'll fly off the shelf.

Drago Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
I think the thread is way off course and you guys have it all wrong. It started by simply announcing that the 37mm plates were available for $30. I think the problem is the price. It's too high. How do you justify the same price for 37mm as for 47mm? If they drop the price to $20, they'll fly off the shelf.

That's simple, there is a lot more metal in the 37 mm plate! [Big Grin]

--------------------
Jim Drago
East Street Auto Salvage
jdrago1@aol.com
2006-2007 Mid-West Division
07,09 June Sprints Champion

EAST STREET RACING

Johnny D Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by Cajun Miata Man:
quote:
Originally posted by Willie the Tard:
I think it is funny how many folks have criticized these changes due to the lack of data (public or private) but at the same time say (without any data) they “know” that this change (or any change to the ’99) is wrong. I have talked to one pro engine builder (that builds all flavors) and his testing showed that the HP curve lines up well with the 1.6 with the NB 1.8 still having a torque advantage(sorry as I only thought ask about 1.6 vs. ’99). So my WAG is that it should be close with the extra weight on the ’99 (over the 1.6). I have no data but another WAG is that the NA 1.8 is the car to have in NASA, but that and anything else that shows in the season can be adjusted cheaply, quickly and easily.


Probably a mistake posting, but.......

Did this engine builder also tell you that the torque advantage quickly dissapears in the rev range that the cars typically race? Have you seen any overlayed data? I have. Assume not by your statement above. BTW, if the "HP curves line up well", torque is the same bud.....

What do you think will happen when torque is quickly matched/hp equal but one car weighs ~120 lbs more? (Assuming all else equal)

I don't run NASA anymore for a variety of reasons, so it doesn't really matter to me, but I figured I would throw that bone out. In my opinion, a 99 should not win in NASA. If it does, the 1.6 might be a turd or the 99 pilot a clearly better driver. Just my [twocents]

Does James hold the key?
NA light no torque.
NB heavy now with no/equal torque.
Throw that 120lbs on the NA and we're even?
J~

--------------------
Avatar Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ww9cFE3lKcA

Alex Bolanos Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Cliffy Chains:
I am bored at work, so thought I would "Stir" [Big Grin]

This rule change that Nasa has done IMO is genius, it attracts all the NA type cars, seeing how most everyone complains in SCCA the 99's are too much to handle for the normal drivers. This I feel will attract alot of the SCCA NA owners to the Nasa battle grounds in 2011. [thumbsup]

"Stir some more" The high caliber of driver that are usually in the 99' cars, will probably show up with their 1.6 or their 1.8 cars in tote, thus not changing the view on the podium for the most part, only the view in Impound. [Eek!]

This plate change has tempted alot of drivers to rethink their schedules for 2011, me included. Not because I can run against Nasa competitors, but a field that I think will mostly be contested by the NA cars.

"A little seasoning with the stir" So at the next event I will pack up my poor, power deprived, 1.6 and arrive with all intentions of seeing alot of familiar faces in unfamiliar cars. [fight]
I think the job the SCCA has done with parity is the closest it has been since I started, yet all the "high caliber" drivers seem to be in their 99's??? I also think Nasa's approach, in the end, will have us even closer, come sept, than ever before. [twocents]

Word is Mazda is paying $1000 for the NASA regional championship...

Here comes the 1.8 [Wink]

Jim Blaisdell
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Mazda paid $1000 last year also for NASA Regional Championship. And $750 for second and $500 for third.
John A. won the NASA FL Regional Championship!!!(in a 1.6).
I got second in a (1.8 NA car).

This on top of the Toyo Bucks all the drivers recieved all season long (Top 5 spots from each of the 18 races we ran).

All this speculative ruling (complaining) about the new rule set...should not diminish the exceptional contingencies that are available racing with NASA.

--------------------
Jim Blaisdell
NASA FL Spec Miata Series Director
5XRacing Team Driver

Tom Sager Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by Drago:
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
I think the thread is way off course and you guys have it all wrong. It started by simply announcing that the 37mm plates were available for $30. I think the problem is the price. It's too high. How do you justify the same price for 37mm as for 47mm? If they drop the price to $20, they'll fly off the shelf.

That's simple, there is a lot more metal in the 37 mm plate! [Big Grin]
Wait a minute...

More metal = less horsepower
Less horsepower = less value
Less value = lower price

Seriously, we don't yet know how much quicker the '99 will be around a course at the lighter weight. We also don't know what the best power output will be at 37mm and we probably won't know until a couple clever engine builders make an effort to build the best power they can at 37mm. What works best at 41mm might not be what works best at 37mm. I know the rules are very restrictive, but motor development never stands still.

kwebb
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
quote:
Originally posted by Drago:
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
I think the thread is way off course and you guys have it all wrong. It started by simply announcing that the 37mm plates were available for $30. I think the problem is the price. It's too high. How do you justify the same price for 37mm as for 47mm? If they drop the price to $20, they'll fly off the shelf.

That's simple, there is a lot more metal in the 37 mm plate! [Big Grin]
Wait a minute...

More metal = less horsepower
Less horsepower = less value
Less value = lower price

Seriously, we don't yet know how much quicker the '99 will be around a course at the lighter weight. We also don't know what the best power output will be at 37mm and we probably won't know until a couple clever engine builders make an effort to build the best power they can at 37mm. What works best at 41mm might not be what works best at 37mm. I know the rules are very restrictive, but motor development never stands still.

Those sneaky engine builders had better get a quick start on this to have it ready and tested track, and tech true before Sept! [duck]

--------------------
Kyle Webb
#96 SM

MPR22
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quote:
Originally posted by kwebb:
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
quote:
Originally posted by Drago:
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Sager:
I think the thread is way off course and you guys have it all wrong. It started by simply announcing that the 37mm plates were available for $30. I think the problem is the price. It's too high. How do you justify the same price for 37mm as for 47mm? If they drop the price to $20, they'll fly off the shelf.

That's simple, there is a lot more metal in the 37 mm plate! [Big Grin]
Wait a minute...

More metal = less horsepower
Less horsepower = less value
Less value = lower price

Seriously, we don't yet know how much quicker the '99 will be around a course at the lighter weight. We also don't know what the best power output will be at 37mm and we probably won't know until a couple clever engine builders make an effort to build the best power they can at 37mm. What works best at 41mm might not be what works best at 37mm. I know the rules are very restrictive, but motor development never stands still.

Those sneaky engine builders had better get a quick start on this to have it ready and tested track, and tech true before Sept! [duck]
Easy fix, new ECU mapping about $600 [shame] . Voila, your 99 is still the fourth best car for the series. [Wink]

--------------------
Michael Ross

B(Kuch) Kucera 45 Verified Driver
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I was planning on doing some NASA this year,now reading this makes me have to smile!
How the rolls (crying) have changed ! [Razz]

Maybe I will have a chance this year with my under powered 1.6! [Big Grin]

--------------------
Bob
!KUCH!

"All my drinking buddies have a racing problem"

WildBill88
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Good thing I kept the 95 for a reason.

d mathias Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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What Kuch said.

If nothing else, NASA's rules have given 1.6 owners hope.

kwebb
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quote:
Originally posted by d mathias:
What Kuch said.

If nothing else, NASA's rules have given 1.6 owners hope.

I wonder if this many OHIO men got excited when they came out with VIAGRA!!!!! Now that is some real hope NASA must be on to something! [crackup]

--------------------
Kyle Webb
#96 SM

Willie the Tard Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by d mathias:
What Kuch said.

If nothing else, NASA's rules have given 1.6 owners hope.

The hope that NASA has given me is that it is willing to make changes; unlike others who have seen one car dominate and said “thank you for your input”.

--------------------
William Keeling a.k.a. Willie the Tard

d mathias Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Don't know 'bout you Kyle, but I don't need any little blue pills. [Razz]

fishguyaz
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quote:
Originally posted by d mathias:
What Kuch said.

If nothing else, NASA's rules have given 1.6 owners hope.

this is where i am confused.
I clearly get it that the 99 is the car to have(TCTH) at road america, and the results show this FOR THIS ONE PARTICULAR TRACK, but the 2 scca nationals that have been run out here in the Sopac region this year show something else to me from looking at the results.
the phx race was won by a 1.6 on sunday, and a 1995 the next day.
I dont think that there was more than (1) 99 car on the podium total for both races.
I saw the results from the SCCA nat. @ california speedway race the next weekend, and it shows the same thing i saw in phx; a 1995 car winning, then a 1.6 in second, and then a 2001 car in 3rd.
where are the "99 overdogs that must be slowed down"? there were 99s racing both weekends, and driven by quality drivers but they somehow didnt dominate.
what i see is pretty good overall balance between the cars. some cars are better in other areas of the track than others are.
oh well

[ 01-27-2011, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: fishguyaz ]

--------------------
Josh Pitt
AZ Region

kwebb
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quote:
Originally posted by d mathias:
Don't know 'bout you Kyle, but I don't need any little blue pills. [Razz]

Denny I wasn't implying that you did! [laughing]

Just find it fasinating that Ohio is the hotbed for those who seem to be most passionate about the NASA rules both sides of them, I would think that is because NASA is such a big thing in Ohio!

I just hope you guys are this passionate when it comes to SCCA MO race number one, I for one am now looking forward to May much more than April!

[thumbsup]

[ 01-28-2011, 01:55 PM: Message edited by: kwebb ]

--------------------
Kyle Webb
#96 SM

B(Kuch) Kucera 45 Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by kwebb:
quote:
Originally posted by d mathias:
Don't know 'bout you Kyle, but I don't need any little blue pills. [Razz]

Denny I wasn't implying that you did! [laughing]

Just find it fasinating that Ohio is the hotbed for those who seem to be most passionate about the NASA rules both sides of them, I would think that is because NASA is such a big thing in Ohio!

I just hope you guys are this passionate when it comnes to SCCA MO race number one, I for one am now looking forward to May much more than April!

[thumbsup]

Hey Kyle,let me start by saying I had a blast running with you at Mid-O.I will be running both this year (what I can afford that is)and hope to run with you again either in SCCA or NASA! [thumbsup]

--------------------
Bob
!KUCH!

"All my drinking buddies have a racing problem"

Cliffy Chains
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quote:
Originally posted by fishguyaz:

the phx race was won by a 1.6 on sunday, and a 1995 the next day.
the results from the SCCA nat. @ california speedway race the next weekend, a 1995 car winning, then a 1.6 in second, and then a 2001 car in 3rd.
where are the "99 overdogs that must be slowed down"? there were 99s racing both weekends, and driven by quality drivers but they somehow didnt dominate.

Not pretending to know your tracks, but 73mph avg speed for PIR plays perfectly for a 1.6, and I think the driver of that 1.6 may have been doing this for longer than just a few years. [Confused]

On the other hand Cal Speedway avg speed of 85mph I was shocked that a 99 was not the winner, [boggled] then I looked at the driver of the 95 car that won. [Eek!]
Valafar?
He qualifies as top level competition, even down here in the boonies where our front 99's are filled with :
Some old guy, A midget, A Cuban Refugee, A guy with some donuts, A Photographer with a new suit, ocassionally even a Marine Core Lunatic, A Fat dude from the Scrapyard and a Hillbilly with some Miller Lite that builds a few SM's. [yep]

Maybe the Depth of Competition may directly relate to Geographical area, maybe not.. [twocents]

--------------------
BDR Motorsports, Autotechnik
Cliff Blanchard
Down on power 1.6
Sluggish overweight 99'

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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Cal Speedway racing seems to be similar to talledaga racing in NASCAR. Drafting strategy is a bigger deal than whether your car is down 2 horsepower I suspect. I wouldn't look at Cal Speed results for parity clues unless the parity is way off. Hell, I had 5 cars in a conga line blow past me like I was standing still when I was leading.

I won the PIR race in my 95 by simply being the fastest in the infield and (as far as I know) the only driver really smashing the curbs that weekend.

Also the #2 guy taking out Sammy didn't hurt my chances either [Smile]

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Cliffy Chains:
quote:
Originally posted by fishguyaz:

the phx race was won by a 1.6 on sunday, and a 1995 the next day.
the results from the SCCA nat. @ california speedway race the next weekend, a 1995 car winning, then a 1.6 in second, and then a 2001 car in 3rd.
where are the "99 overdogs that must be slowed down"? there were 99s racing both weekends, and driven by quality drivers but they somehow didnt dominate.

Not pretending to know your tracks, but 73mph avg speed for PIR plays perfectly for a 1.6, and I think the driver of that 1.6 may have been doing this for longer than just a few years. [Confused]

On the other hand Cal Speedway avg speed of 85mph I was shocked that a 99 was not the winner, [boggled] then I looked at the driver of the 95 car that won. [Eek!]
Valafar?
He qualifies as top level competition, even down here in the boonies where our front 99's are filled with :
Some old guy, A midget, A Cuban Refugee, A guy with some donuts, A Photographer with a new suit, ocassionally even a Marine Core Lunatic, A Fat dude from the Scrapyard and a Hillbilly with some Miller Lite that builds a few SM's. [yep]

Maybe the Depth of Competition may directly relate to Geographical area, maybe not.. [twocents]

The real tough West coast races generally start in March when the San Francisco and Oregon/Northwest regions start doing battle. In the past Rampleburg, Caddell, Drennan, Sutherland, Cross and Schrader have battled it out at the Thunderhill double national (avg speed 81.7). I expect this year will be especially fun to watch as a few of the top 1.6s will be battling with a few talented 99 drivers so stay tuned.

-bw

--------------------
Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

Connie 62 Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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I received the 37mm plate from NASA today. That is a small hole.

--------------------
Jim Thill
#11 SSM
#3 ITA
Thrillz Racing

 
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