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Author Topic: SoCal NASA: June 27 - 28, 2009 @ Buttonwillow - ROLL CALL
John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
Car #: 13
Year : 1992
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quote:
Originally posted by Sean Allen:
When will the schedule be up?

Tuesday or Wed

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
Car #: 13
Year : 1992
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Nice job everyone and thanks for registering early. With 25 cars we'll have our own Group C. Here is the SCHEDULE

NOTE: There is a BBQ & Beer dinner served Saturday night... Cost is FREE & the BBQ has always been good. Please stick around for it and catch the start of the enduro all starting @ 6:30.

Weather forecast is for HOT, so make sure you drink plenty of water. Try to stay away from carbonated beverages, especially those with caffeine and alcohol (until after your last session that is [Smile] ).

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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Will the supersize be offered?

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

jeremybarnes
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Can I place my vote for a qualifying race on Sunday, so the schedule would be qualify in session 1, qualifying race in session 2 (grid set from qualifying session), main race in session 3 (grid set from finishing position of qual race).

Anyone have an issue, or reason not to? This has become our norm when we have our own run group so far this year, and I -- for one -- think it's a lot more fun.

Jeremy.

Yellow SM 14

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by jeremybarnes:
Can I place my vote for a qualifying race on Sunday, so the schedule would be qualify in session 1, qualifying race in session 2 (grid set from qualifying session), main race in session 3 (grid set from finishing position of qual race).

Anyone have an issue, or reason not to? This has become our norm when we have our own run group so far this year, and I -- for one -- think it's a lot more fun.

Jeremy.

Yellow SM 14

+1

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
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Year : 1992
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+1 too

I've got the Supersize request in & will post once I hear.

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
Car #: 13
Year : 1992
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Supersize is being offered: for $99 !!

We've got the okay for Sunday Qualify Heat race too. There will be announcement at the Drivers meeting too.

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by John Mueller:
Supersize is being offered: for $99 !!

We've got the okay for Sunday Qualify Heat race too. There will be announcement at the Drivers meeting too.

Woohoo!!! I am in for PTE!

If only I had the budget for a 100* SM/PTE/E2 ironman [Wink]

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

GW
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what is everybodies thoughts about asking for removal of the bus stop so we have 1 good passing zone.

In addition Talledega is way more fun going counter clockwise with no bus stop and flat out.

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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Grant are you sure you want to give valafar a passing opportunity [Confused] [burst]

jeremybarnes
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I could go either way on that. I actually like the bus stop, but I do agree it makes a track that's already hard to pass on even harder to pass on. I'll go with the majority rule on this.

Jeremy.

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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quote:
Originally posted by GW:
what is everybodies thoughts about asking for removal of the bus stop so we have 1 good passing zone.

In addition Talledega is way more fun going counter clockwise with no bus stop and flat out.

I like the Bus Stop going CCW, but carrying all that speed through 'dega would be a hoot. I'm with Jeremy on this, I'll go with what the majority wants.

GW could you send out an email or do you want me to?

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Great racing with everyone!!!!

Sorry for the Full course Yellow on Sunday. Star Mazda got really slippery and I had to test out the 5 second penalty for dropping a tire. Unfortunately the "Self Imposed" penalty ended up being 2:13.

Sorry for the bump on Eric and the harder than intended dump draft on Marc Simon.

Major kudos and a sincere thank you to RLC Racing and Jennifer for getting my data and video to work together. Your track commander ROCKS!!!!!! and your attention to customer service will insure great success.

See everyone at Miller!!!

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

Shawn@sampsonracing.com Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Also had on off at Star Mazda on Sunday on lap3 and as I was sat covered in sweat and that wonderful BW dirt... thought to myself, Fun's over... I want a cold beer and shower. By the time I made it back on the track the SM train was long gone. Now I wished I would have stayed out w/ that full course Yellow but then again when I downloaded the Data logger temp in the car was 132deg... maybe that beer was the right call.

Wanted say a big thanks to Louis from Rush Motorsports and Jeremy Barns/Tim Buck (Mazda)for your help and support during the weekend. After 4 years of not being in SM I had a blast but bringing a crate motor to a filed of 28 cars puts you right in the "Kill Zone" which was "fun" and very interesting...

--------------------
Shawn Sampson/Sampson Racing Communications
Offical NASA Racing Communication Company
NASA SM/PTE/E3
2005- 1st Place EO 25 Hour Enduro NASA 86' Mazda Rx7 (RIP)
http://www.SampsonRacing.com
http://www.SRCProducts.com
Toll Free -866-396-7231

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
Car #: 13
Year : 1992
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Big thanks for every one making it despite mothers natures intent on cooking us alive. 25cars in a group is huge in any weather!

Special thanks to all the new NASA racers (Marc, Chuck, welcome back Shawn, sorry if I'm missing anyone)... AND to those who drove in from NorCal (Sean Allen), Oregon (John Sauce), and Vegas (Sammy).

There were so many people who I wanted to get around to talk with but between my motor breaking on the 3rd lap of Saturdays race and the stupid-heat messing with my heart meds I had to leave Sun morning. Sorry.

It was great to see everyone walk away from the 4-car wreck @ Sunset (T1-CCW), kudos to the car builders especially for Curtis & Bill (those were hard hits)

So, besides Douglass messing up the track on Sunday [duck] how'd everything else go.

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Another apology goes out to the visiting red #14 (wasn't AJ). On saturdays race we went through sunrise side by side. I attempted to leave him enough room on the outside, but it appeared that he dropped a tire and spun or almost spun. Didn't see the result but regardless, wasn't trying to run you out of room

Great racing with you.

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

ethan666
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Year : 1991
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Just heard about the big wreck in T1, that sucks. Everyone's safety gear work as expected? From what I heard a head-on hit?

Sounds like I missed out on an incredibly hot and crazy weekend.

--------------------
ethan

HWJunkie
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I want to thank Louis, Grant, Chuck, Clement and everyone else that helped me!!!!

And it was nice racing with you Sean and I believe that Shawn and I did some racing as well. I think though we were in a good spot, as the "kill zone" on Saturday was ahead of us. But hey, it was my second race, first time at BW and my car looks almost like it did when I brought it there except for alot of added dirt and sand in and on the car [Smile] , so i'm happy about that at least.

Looking forward to the next race!

--------------------
Marc Simon

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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Damn.

http://www.trackhq.com/forums/photopost562/showphoto.php/photo/16360 (requires DivX)

Didn't see the initial spin, thought the skreech from it was coming from the blue car locking tires. The red car ended up right where I wanted to go just before I got there.

I got hit in the rear just after the apex, which put me into a slide which killed any outside shot of digging my way out of this one.

I was a ways under the limit of adhesion so there might have been hope for a much softer shunt on the back of the black car, but I dug myself pretty deep.

Should have shifted more attention further down the track sooner after winning the braking duel.

[banghead]


Some discussion and links to more videos over here:
http://www.trackhq.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2300

Includes the results of a lubed up riverside.

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

CGong
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Here is the video from Saturday's crash http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBiBPSF3_eI

I was hit 4 times. Initialy by Brian (rear bumper), then Tyler (rear bumper), Rob (driver's side door), and Bill (head on). Pretty scary ride. Fortunately no serious injuries to anyone involved.

Not sure if Brian was trying to pass 2 cars at once in the braking zone of T1 or if he just overshot when trying to pass the car behind me. In any case, a serious miscalculation which resulted in my car being completely totalled and 3 others being damaged.

Perhaps the most disturbing part of this incident was my initial conversation with Brian where he was trying to convince me that he was side by side, front wheel to front wheel with me and that I turned in on him. Not sure what this says about his situational awareness. Ultimately, after seeing video, he did admit fault.

Curtis

Mark Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Curtis,

Sorry to hear your car is toast but I'm really glad to hear that all drivers are ok after seeing the video. Those were some hard hits.

--------------------
Mark
http://www.ironcanyonmotorsports.com

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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Ow. Geez, I can't even distinguish between my hit and Bill's in the video.

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

Jason Holland Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Mediocrity rules!

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Ugly.

--------------------
Jason Holland
Semi-interested civilian

Shawn@sampsonracing.com Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Curtis- Man am I sorry for your loss... been there and done that, due to others lack of driving skill and over driving.

This might not be PC...

I was the last person in that train and I must say that others should have been way more heads-up under the same conditions (where am I going WHEN... ). To get hit and spun is one thing (loss of control... can you say seeing RED!) but to be hit at a stop is due to complete lack of driver care and awaness. There was more than enough time to take a very safe action due to the original spin for all but maybe one person (Tyler) but after that I watched as a few other drivers just stayed in race mode and thus a ton more damage was caused...

Its called racecraft, which takes years to developed and a few totaled cars (in my history as well) but you have to be way more heads-up and willing to SLOW THE F$@K DOWN when a car is out of control! I'm not taking about lifting... I'm Saying foot on the brakes, drive away form the action and be happy to just be passed by a few drivers if need-be and not be sitting in Curtis's shoes...

Loved being back in a SM and the racing was a ton of fun... but there is no reason that Curtis's car should be totaled if others had been more Proactive and not Reactive-

--------------------
Shawn Sampson/Sampson Racing Communications
Offical NASA Racing Communication Company
NASA SM/PTE/E3
2005- 1st Place EO 25 Hour Enduro NASA 86' Mazda Rx7 (RIP)
http://www.SampsonRacing.com
http://www.SRCProducts.com
Toll Free -866-396-7231

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Curtis,

I'm sorry for the loss of your car. As you sit and build it, work on it, and ultimately race it you do begin to establish a relationship with it and beyond the pure expense of the loss, you also lose the relationship with your car. ( I felt like I was cheating on my 96 when I was building the 99)

But with the 138 degree in car temps and watching the replays of many videos including mine it alot easier to see bad judgements or bad guesses. And not to defend Brian but I don't believe that situational awareness would have prevented his hitting you. His "Red Mist" and bigger eyes than brakes is what caused it.

The situational awareness and especially luck or lack therof of the other drivers behind you (including myself) is what caused the damage.

I simply lucked out. I saw you get spun around and I quickly decided to go around the outside as Tyler decided to go on the inside. He simply guessed wrong. (One could say that I evaluated the situation correctly and choose to go on the outside because of more runoff room and better grip going around the outside. But truely in 138 degree weather, I was just lucky) Had Tyler braked a fraction more he may have had the grip to turn in more and not hit Curtis. (but that is a fraction of a second decision)

Rob had more time to react (3 sec. according to video) but didnt appear to see the incident. He couldn't go to the outside as Bill appears to be there or heading there and when he decided to go to the inside someone tapped him (maybe Bill when Rob checked up?). Had he seen th incident develop, maybe Rob could have braked hard before the turn (which could have resulted in Bill punting Rob off the track but not in the vicinity of Curtis)

Bill had the same time to react, but it appears that he might have been blinded by Rob's car being in the way visually. So Bill appeared to be along for the ride. And maybe and I mean maybe, if Rob broke hard and Bill punted Rob it may have slowed down Bill enough to allow him more choices of escape.

Then theres always the shooter on the grassy knoll....

.....Its easy to Monday morning quarterback but 138 degree in car temps, 3 packs of cars separated by 4 seconds all battling for position in 1 of only 3 passing locations, and bad luck resulted in 1 totaled and 3 badly damaged cars.

In reality, I don't see what could have been done to prevent it as luck or lack thereof often superseeds situational awareness and skill...

One thing to be learned about it is not to make judgements, arguements or guesses on what occured until you see the video, because your memory is not that good when your overheated.

As for the penalties assessed...I would suggest that we be very very careful to penalize on the inital action of the faulting driver and not on the end result of his actions. As emotion can often superseed rational assessment.

Again, Curtis I am sorry for what it cost you. and in the words of a Funeral Director, "I'm sorry for your loss!" It's always great to race with you and although we too have met by "accident", I always look forward to more racing in the future with you.

If there is anything I can help you with please call!

Sean

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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My post was being written before Shawn posted his. So my post is in no way a rebuttal to Shawn, and is simply my opinion.

I respect his background and experience.

Shawn, Hopefully you will continue to come out with us! (But you have to learn to spell your name right)

Sean

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Rob,

Can you move your camera down and zoom out a little in the future? It is really distracting and provides for a less entertaining experience for the rest of us. [duck]

But honestly, it does restrict you from seeing alot of information on the drivers side which could help in analysis, future incidents or what your hands were doing during a turn (I personally don't want to know what else they could be doing but it may help you) [rolling on floor laughin]

Sean

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

Tvance13
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I looked at our video last night and Sean is right in that he had but a fraction of a second to respond. His hands are at full lock to the right and the brakes are completely engaged. Curtis was still in motion when he entered the corner and according to Curtis he was along for the ride at that point from the initial impact. Tyler went as low as he could and the car rolled in his direction. Bad luck, but what can you do. I called spin on the radio as it occurred, it is just one of those things. It does appear to me that there may have been time for the drivers behind them, case in point Ken Saward and his save. Any way, time to get the check book out. In all of this I feel for Curtis. He has a much bigger bill to pay.

--------------------
http://TylerVanceRacing.com

Shawn@sampsonracing.com Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Hey Sean- none taken, that's for sure.

We all learn a little something every time we get on the track-

BTW The Norwegians have never liked the Irish [duck]

--------------------
Shawn Sampson/Sampson Racing Communications
Offical NASA Racing Communication Company
NASA SM/PTE/E3
2005- 1st Place EO 25 Hour Enduro NASA 86' Mazda Rx7 (RIP)
http://www.SampsonRacing.com
http://www.SRCProducts.com
Toll Free -866-396-7231

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by Shawn@sampsonracing.com:
I'm Saying foot on the brakes, drive away form the action and be happy to just be passed by a few drivers if need-be and not be sitting in Curtis's shoes...

Preaching to the choir man. In lap 1 Curtis tried to pass me back on the inside of sunrise. I might have been within my right to chop his nose off, but instead I elected to leave room and take an arc that would force me off, allowing 4 cars past before I could carefully bring it back on.

When Curtis went around, I was keeping an eye on Bill and never saw it. In a flash he was obscured by other cars, and I didn't see the two scouts ahead jumping on their brakes so I figured things were frisky, but normal.

Everything went to hell in a handbasket in a big hurry. Curtis was struck as I first saw him and moving left, and I might have had Bill still out there so I looked to the right and *thunk* hit from behind.

Hehe... if I chopped Curtis' nose off on the out lap, we'd still all have our cars... [Big Grin]

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

Brian B
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I feel very sick when I think about that fact that the initial event was caused by my error.
The event all happened so fast, and surprised me at the time, I (in error) thought that I would have room which caused Curtis to spin and started the cascading events. I canít say how bad I feel for everyone who had damaged their cars, especially Curtis.
Here is the video I have (first lap of race, plus the turn one crash... note my rear camera after the initial contact to see Curtis get hit again.)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwYCxo_2OkI

Hope to see everyone back up and racing soon.

--------------------
Brian Bender
SM 64

Rob Burgoon Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by SWDouglass:
Rob,

Can you move your camera down and zoom out a little in the future? It is really distracting and provides for a less entertaining experience for the rest of us. [duck]

But honestly, it does restrict you from seeing alot of information on the drivers side which could help in analysis, future incidents or what your hands were doing during a turn (I personally don't want to know what else they could be doing but it may help you) [rolling on floor laughin]

Sean

No zoom. I miss my old camera location, above my right shoulder. It was great and showed the wheel, but now the wide rear view is in the way of seeing forward.

--------------------
It really makes my week when nobody crashes into me.

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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It has been a tremendous act to see the group come together and help Curtis from the financial hit. It shows a great cohesiveness of our region. And that cohesiveness makes the racing really enjoyable!

I hope those donations bring the driver's Great Karma!!!

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

Region: SoCal
Car #: 13
Year : 1992
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quote:
Originally posted by SWDouglass:

I hope those donations bring the driver's Great Karma!!!

... Karma, find me a new motor for cheap [yep]

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

 
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