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Author Topic: heel toe practice?
Steve Sturm Verified Driver
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Region: WDC
Car #: 90
Year : 1990
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Are any of these simulators useful for learning/practicing heel-toe shifting? and that would translate to real-world racing?

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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Region: Oregon
Car #: 68
Year : 91
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No simulators won't help with learning heal & Toe. Best to learn that in your daily driver. Have a automatic or SMG? get rid of it and go find yourself a manual. Oh, and don't buy an M3, the pedals are so perfectly matched and so close together, you'll be spoiled and have to re-learn when you get into a regular street car i.e. Miata.

-b

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Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

Juan Pineda Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Car #: 34
Year : 1992
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Actually, I found the simulator helpful in learning and teaching heel toe. The big problem with the pedals is that the brake pedal is generally too soft. I got a G27 wheel/pedal set with an after market load cell modification for the brake. I use iRacing.com.

The simulation isn't real, and you don't have G forces, so you have to figure out what the simulator is telling you and translate. So for example, when you don't match revs, you hear a screech that is much more subtle than the real experience. Nevertheless, I found it helpful for learning new tricks. For example, I learned to row down the gears instead of skip, and to move shifting later. Also learned to left foot brake. Much of it is programming in new patterns into the brain and muscle memory.

I also used the system to teach a friend how to heel toe. It's great because I could see exactly what she was doing with her feet, and debug the problems. We used the skid pad, and I had her drive straight across, shifting and turning right before the wall. Worked great.

It's a great tool. But I would use it only in combination with practicing on the street too. Real dynamics are important.

-Juan

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www.ArtOfRoadRacing.com Race Craft Clinic - Thunderhill - 30 Jan 2011

TR6
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Car #: 500
Year : 2002
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Only way to really learn it is in the car. And the stock miata pedals are a real challenge for H/T, in my opinion. I could H/T my 911 in my sleep, but when I moved to miata, I had to re-learn to do it with that little tiny accelerator pedal. Nothing will get your attention like having your foot slip off while you are downshifting in a short braking zone...

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Greg H.
2002 red Miata #500
Denton, Texas

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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Region: Oregon
Car #: 68
Year : 91
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quote:
Originally posted by Juan Pineda:
The big problem with the pedals is that the brake pedal is generally too soft. I got a G27 wheel/pedal set with an after market load cell modification for the brake. I use iRacing.com.

Interested in hearing more Juan. The brake pedal is one of the biggest reasons I stopped racing sims. A while back I heard there was a Wheel/pedal set that was pressure activated, but as far as I know it's no longer available. I haven't explored this in a while, so please elaborate.

Great seeing you at the 25. Thanks for the Pie!!!

-bw

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Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

Juan Pineda Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Veteran Member

Region: San Francisco
Car #: 34
Year : 1992
Posts: 2279
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Hey Bruce,

Glad you liked my baking. I handed out seven of those that weekend. Awesome run for you guys. Great job of recovering from that lost wheel at the very end.

This is the brake pedal mod I used:

http://www.apelectrix.com/

Only $60. It just bolts into a G25/G27. And I got a Playseat, which is all plug and play with the G25/G27. They give you all the mounting bolts and even the allen wrenches.

I just ordered it all last month, so it's all still in production. Much cheaper than the real thing!

-Juan

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www.ArtOfRoadRacing.com Race Craft Clinic - Thunderhill - 30 Jan 2011

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
Gold Member

Region: Oregon
Car #: 68
Year : 91
Posts: 2359
Status: Offline
Icon 1 posted  Profile for B Wilson   Author's Homepage     Edit/Delete Post  Report this post to a Moderator

Thanks Juan, I think it was Carroll Smith in Drive to Win, that explained about how a mushy pedal was bad as it required the brain to process both pressure and distance for modulation, and that a driver could threashold brake more effectively dealing with just one variable, i.e. pressure. Obviously the makers of the pedal mod agree.

Thanks!

-bw

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Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

   

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