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Author Topic: Jesse Combs First National Victory!!
Karl Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
2001 ARRC Winner


Region: SW
Car #: 50
Year : 1600
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Way to go Jesse!!!!

Remember our classified for "the fastest 1600" last year? Jesse finally did what I couldn't do and proved it.

After a best of the rest fastest lap time at the first double national in the SW division in February, Jesse finally got his victory over Bob Stretch at Pueblo on Saturday. He backed it up with the pole on Sunday but ran out of tires and could only manage second.

Well done and good luck at the MX-5 pro race in Houston this weekend!!!!!

Blake Clements Verified Driver Series Champ
MegaModerator

Region: SW - Houston
Car #: 6
Year : 99, 96
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WTG Jess!! It was the "Texas Gate" Out of Division weekend. LOL

--------------------
Blake Clements

PhillipsRacePrep/SP Induction Systems/East Street Racing/MiataCage.com/Carbotech/WBR Graphics

www.blakeclements.com

Charlie James Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
Team SafeRacer

Region: Neokla
Car #: 40
Year : 94
Posts: 383
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Congrats Jesse!
Jesse and Matt, 2 first timers in 1 weekend!!!
Quite a few competitive drivers out in our national fields.

--------------------
www.SafeRacer.com
"Life is short, Eternity is forever"

Drago Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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Region: mid south
Car #: 2
Year : 1999
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Congrats Jesse, now stay in Texas along with Matt! [Big Grin]
I wasn't going to, but Blake brought it! Texas Gate the Sequel...
http://txrollergirls.com/hotrodhoneys/index.htm

I was going to put all your names above one...

I ordered a few of these for all out of Texas Sm drivers headed to Texas nationals as well...

http://www.spreadshirt.com/shop.php?op=article&article_id=828456#top

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Jim Drago
East Street Auto Salvage
jdrago1@aol.com
2006-2007 Mid-West Division
07,09 June Sprints Champion

EAST STREET RACING

mullet


Region: SW
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Year : 93
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quote:
Originally posted by Karl:
Way to go Jesse!!!!

Remember our classified for "the fastest 1600" last year? Jesse finally did what I couldn't do and proved it.

After a best of the rest fastest lap time at the first double national in the SW division in February, Jesse finally got his victory over Bob Stretch at Pueblo on Saturday. He backed it up with the pole on Sunday but ran out of tires and could only manage second.

Well done and good luck at the MX-5 pro race in Houston this weekend!!!!!

Congrats to Jesse!!!!!!!!!
I thought the 99 was an overdog Karl? [Confused]

Mark Franklin Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Region: Colorado
Car #: 25
Year : 1991
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That T shirt is sort of funny, sort of true. Some of us who followed certain Texas drivers this weekend have sore throats, sore eyes, and persistent dizziness. My partner was barfing up blood on the cool down lap. I think we need a closer look at fuel. Exhaust from gasoline is one thing. Exhaust from this race fuel, even if it passes tech, is obviously another.

Mark

--------------------
SM #25 RMD

Jason Holland Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Mediocrity rules!

Region: SouthEast
Car #: 28
Year : 95
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If that's true Mark, that's pretty f'ing serious.

Jason

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Jason Holland
Semi-interested civilian

Steven Holloway Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Blue Eyes, Aquarius, hates being squeezed to the grass in SowDiv!

Region: Lonestar
Car #: 97
Year : 91
Posts: 740
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Hey Drago,
My wife works with one of the RollerGirls, she thinks racers are cool. Want me set up an intro next time you're in Tx?
S

--------------------
If you can't fix it with a hammer, it's got electrical problems.

asennafan
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Year : 96
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It is true. I was there. It is pretty bad when immediately after taking the checkered flag one of our buddies Jumps out of his car in turn one vomiting blood.

--------------------
Shannon J. Sweeney
#0 SM RMDIV

Drago Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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Region: mid south
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Year : 1999
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quote:
Originally posted by Steven Holloway:
Hey Drago,
My wife works with one of the RollerGirls, she thinks racers are cool. Want me set up an intro next time you're in Tx?
S

Those girls would hand me a beating, I'm staying away!
[Wink]

--------------------
Jim Drago
East Street Auto Salvage
jdrago1@aol.com
2006-2007 Mid-West Division
07,09 June Sprints Champion

EAST STREET RACING

Blake Clements Verified Driver Series Champ
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Region: SW - Houston
Car #: 6
Year : 99, 96
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Did the fuel pass a fuel test at the track?

--------------------
Blake Clements

PhillipsRacePrep/SP Induction Systems/East Street Racing/MiataCage.com/Carbotech/WBR Graphics

www.blakeclements.com

Willie the Tard Verified Driver
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Car #: 8
Year : 92
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Good job Jesse

good luck this weekend

Mark Franklin Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Year : 1991
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Fuel was tested with the reagent test at the track on several cars, chosen randomly. One of the suspect cars' fuel was red in color and passed the test.

Personally, I'd like to see a more reliable test for doctored fuel, as I've heard that very expensive fuel is available that has 2-5% more power. That fuel's high price is justified by its ability to mask the presence of the HP enhancers, which are suspected to be harmful and maybe carcinogenic, even in exhaust.

--------------------
SM #25 RMD

Little Bill Verified Driver
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I never thought I would be happy not being at the front but this weekend I count my blessings.

Letís face facts. Any chemist worth his salt can design a masking agent that will cause the desired result with reagent tests.

The only way to know what is in complex compound such as racing fuel that may contain ILLEGAL additives (oxygenators) is to run them through a mass spectrometer. Then everything present in the compound in question can be properly identified.

When is enough going to be enough? Is it so important to win a freaking stupid race, that one must run a fuel with additives that have highly toxic byproducts after being combusted under high pressure.

I didn't find out until after the 30 minute protest time how the exhaust fumes had affected Bill (the driver mentioned in Mark's post). Had I known in a timely fashion, I would have protested the fuel and insisted that the fuel be run through a mass spec. Reagent test can be tricked, they tell you very little about the compound being tested.

Knowing someone is illegal and proving someone is illegal are two different things. We all know that. But, I am in a public forum stating my opinion and crying foul. Iím sure the driver puking blood is thinking the same.

By the way I spoke with Bill on the phone today to see how he was feeling. He is doing okay. He thought that he would wake up felling alright this morning, but told me he awoke feeling severly hung over. He told me about getting out of his car and puking up blood at turn 1 on the cool down lap, then stopping at turn 3 to get some water from the corner station, where they determined that he shouldn't drive his car back to impound, because of his physical condition. NICE EXHAUST.

So when is enough, enough? I'll tell you, when you run a hot fuel that cause the driver that followed you for ten laps (roughly 19 minutes). To pull over and puke blood, thatís enough. To all of you that run these fuels with no concern for your competitors health. Shame on you, grow some stones, be a man, and PLAY BY THE RULES.

Iím sure that this post will be removed very quickly, or at the very least edited for content.

If you have an issue with my opinion, feel free to answer me on this board, or pm me. If you want to speak with me on the phone then PM me; I will respond with my phone number.

Bill Hingston
SM#03
RM-Div

Blake Clements Verified Driver Series Champ
MegaModerator

Region: SW - Houston
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I'd write the CRB if there is something you don't like about gasoline that passes the tests set forth.

Again, WTG Jess!

--------------------
Blake Clements

PhillipsRacePrep/SP Induction Systems/East Street Racing/MiataCage.com/Carbotech/WBR Graphics

www.blakeclements.com

Little Bill Verified Driver
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Blake,

I did it last night as soon as I got home. Maybe you will take it more seriously when it happens to you or someone you care about.

I have been very vocal about this subject at the local level.

No one really listened, but they are now.

--------------------
Bill Hingston
SM#03
RM_Div

Blake Clements Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Little Bill:
Blake,

I did it last night as soon as I got home. Maybe you will take it more seriously when it happens to you or someone you care about.

I have been very vocal about this subject at the local level.

No one really listened, but they are now.

Bill,
Not my battle to argue, because I don't participate in the fuel wars. We whatever is avaliable at the track. I have run against "the fuel" and never gotten sick before. I am all for cost containment, but don't feel it is appropriate to blast people who run what appears to be legal fuel.

I do, however, understand the health concerns and hope those can be addressed.

JMO

--------------------
Blake Clements

PhillipsRacePrep/SP Induction Systems/East Street Racing/MiataCage.com/Carbotech/WBR Graphics

www.blakeclements.com

Jason Holland Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Mediocrity rules!

Region: SouthEast
Car #: 28
Year : 95
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quote:
Originally posted by Blake Clements:
but don't feel it is appropriate to blast people who run what appears to be legal fuel.

JMO

I do have to disagree with you there Blake. If people are knowingly running a fuel that is performance enhancing (of course it is, why else would they run it at the price?) and has the potential for making people sick, then they are way way way wrong. I don't care if the illegality can be detected or not. This is one area where tech shed legal should never, ever be condoned.

As I said in my letter to the CRB, it's bad enough that someone may be cheating with an illegal fuel or additive. But to have your health threatened on top of it, that's just beyond the pale.

If you really need the cheap trophy, try another sport.

I've had the "watery eye" syndrome quite a few times and while it's never made me more than sick to my stomach, I can guarantee you, the next time it happens I will be protesting. And I will be asking for a test that is definitive. Not the stock scca test.

Which brings up a good question. Do we even have the ability to ask for a test other than the standard reagent test? I think an email to scca to check on that is in order.

And that's my opinion...


Jason

--------------------
Jason Holland
Semi-interested civilian

Terry Clements Verified Driver
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Car #: 10
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Blake has never and will never run these types of fuel in question . I do not approve of running these types of fuels and wish SCCA could find a way to police it . Sooner the better .

Terry Clements

fixrim
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Actually, I followed Jesse a lot this weekend, close to him, and him close to me. We had a great time, and neither of us got sick. I suppose the more prudent decision would have been not add the 10% nitromethane to our cars before Sundays race. We'll be more carefult next time. Sorry guys!

mullet


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I have dynoed w/ these fuels several times, even in an enclosed shop without an exhaust fan( it was too cold outside for the persons who owned the shop to open the door) and I have never gotten sick. I am talking about for extended periodos of time not 3 pulls and your done, the only fuel that has ever made me sick was srait pump gas.

I'm not saying this driver wasn't made sick by this fuel, but I find it hard to imagine that someone would puke blood from this.
Please don't think I am trying to be a jerk about this, because it is not my intention, this fuel has been used for quite some time by many with no complaints from any other competitors of being ill.

Maybe it is somethong about the air in Colarado, I don't know?

Did this driver go get checked out by a doctor?
I hope so!

Dusty Bottoms Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
99 all the way!

Region: Lone Star
Year : 1990
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Please clarify something...was it puking blood or coughing blood? BIG difference.

If you're puking blood you need to see a gastroenterologist ASAP. If you coughed up blood you need to see an ENT. Either way you need to get checked for whatever caused that.

I have also run behind some funny smelling fuels...some smell like methanol and didn't make me feel sick. Another smelled like berries and made my eyes water...this was from a leader that had to pass me. I've also been behind a FA during a test session and that stuff was nasty.

Mind you, I raced nitro-methanol powered RC cars for years...the nitro burns "spicy"...stings your nostrils...the methanol actually cleared my sinuses (produces Formaldehyde). That didn't bother me like some fuels I've smelled on track since then.

--------------------
"Your victory is tainted! Asterisk! Asterisk!!!"--Lisa Simpson

Monkeywrench
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I'd be curious to see a blood test from people handling these fuels and the people who are around them (even corner workers, which I do believe there was a study conducted on corner workers who were exposed after a day of volunteering and blood test results were not good)). You also don't need to breath these additives in to poisen yourself, they'll just as easily be absorbed through the skin.

Does SCCA use a water test?

Sounds like nasty stuff... I bet it was a certain alkane or alkene that was mixed into the fuel. Nasty stuff. A few of the oxygenators are Category 1 carcinogens.

quote:
Another smelled like berries and made my eyes water...this was from a leader that had to pass me
Esters.... in a chem lab once, I pulled too much water out of an ester solution I was working on. It felt like being choked by the fragrence of banana's.

This topic probally should be on it's own in the Garage section of the forum.


Also anyone remember the fuel that VP was selling that would react "violently" when tested? [Eek!]

--------------------
-Bob Adams

fixrim
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Seriously, I have run this fuel for some years, and I have never had this issue before. Not like I don't race much, either. As for banning oxygenated fuels, be careful what you wish for, sunoco 104 is one of "these types of fuels" a fairly similiar fuel, oxygenated, and puts out very similiar power to what we run.

As for playing by the rules, we are playing by the rules. In fact, at most events, I volunteer our fuel to be tested BEFORE the event, I did so at this event too. There was never a question of if the fuel is illegal, it simply isn't.

Policing fuels is exactly what they do. Why do you think we all have a fuel port? Up until a few years ago, there was no fuel tech. The rules are set, the fuel passes, I am not sure what "these types of fuels" mean. Ours is race gas, like many others use. If it is going to be an all pump gas rule, then so be it. Get the rule passed, we'll run pump gas. But until then, suggesting we don't play by the rules is simply innacurate. And, by the way, when you fill up with Sunoco, and many others, you ARE running "these types of fuels", meaning, oxygenated. Just go to the VP site and look at the dozens of blends and fuels. It is not a rules violation to figure out which of those works best (unless it doesnt pass).

As for being sick, it is clearly a problem when a driver is ill. However, to suggest for certain that this is from the fuel of the car in front is at best speculation. PUKING blood is a whole lot different from spitting it. In any event, I have been sick quite a few times getting out of a race car. But I have been hesitant to accuse my fellow racer of somehow poisoning me with his exhaust! It is quite possible that the result would have been the same had Jesse had pump gas.

I had a great time racing with all the RM guys, and I am saddened that it has come to harsh words on this message board.

I do hope the Bill and his partner Mark recover well, and I can promise you there is not, was not, and will not be any ill intent on my part.

Monkeywrench
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Fixrim (Bob Stretch right?)

The only real way to solve this problem is to spec a pure alcohol. Not going to happen. All fuels now are oxygenated to a degree.. even the stuff you buy at the pump (and even them are very unhealthy to breath in). The problem with race fuels is that sanctioning bodies outlaw less toxic ways to make the fuels oxygenated, thus competitors must resort to more toxic compounds to find their gains. I'm done with this in here, if there needs to be a discussion on fuel then someone needs to open up a thread in the appropriate forum section.

It's taking away from the accomplishments of Jesse Combs and his crew and all the others who were there. Sorry for adding to the hijack and Congrats on the win!

Also to those who became ill, I hope you recover

--------------------
-Bob Adams

Dusty Bottoms Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
99 all the way!

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Oh yeah, forgot to congratulate Jesse. Way to go man...I bet the pressure is off. Next "virgin" to win will be Andy right? Edit: oops! sorry Jenkins bros. I thought at least one of you had won a race already.

--------------------
"Your victory is tainted! Asterisk! Asterisk!!!"--Lisa Simpson

Dusty Bottoms Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
99 all the way!

Region: Lone Star
Year : 1990
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For an old thread on fuel...go to the driver's only section for those of you with access.

--------------------
"Your victory is tainted! Asterisk! Asterisk!!!"--Lisa Simpson

Little Bill Verified Driver
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No matter what the fuel, engine, tires , or set up, you still have to drive. To that end I say congrats.

As for the rest of it. I take hot fuels very seriously. I believe that we are all responsible for each others safety when we race. Anyone who is knowingly running fuels with oxiginating additives needs to be delt with harshly. First time your caught your race results are forfieted, the next time your out of the club for life. This is a serious issue that needs to delt with.

There is no reason to be running anything more than pump gas with a 9:4:1 engine.

Because I have finals coming up I don't have time to pursue this right now; other than a quick letter to the comp board. But I spoke with one of my Chem instructors and they are going to work with me in the weeks following the semester helping me with the research I will need to approach the national office.

Twenty something dollars a gallon? Why? Cause it will pass the reagent tests thats why. It will be interesting to run it through a mass spec. I will also be very interested to see how many people will be willing to let me have a sample of the gas out of their tank after a race so I can run the samples.

Bill Hingston
SM#03
RM-Div

Kent Carter Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Future Never Has Been

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Congrats to my good buddy Jessie!

Now back to the regularly schedule distraction:

The substances in racing gasoline are unlikely to cause acute hemoptysis or hematemesis. If you look at the MSDS for racing gas and street gas, both look pretty ugly from a toxicology standpoint. I'm like the rest of you, I hate being behind a car burning that stuff as it makes me nauseous and watery-eyed.

I do know of several substances that can contribute:
1. tequila
2. scotch
3. bourbon
4. vodka
5. ibuprofen
6. aspirin
7. so on

Antonio is right (even if he is just an engineer [Big Grin] ). This guy needs to get to a doctor before he races again. He may have a serious medical condition.

--------------------
Do I turn my 99 Hard S into a killerfast SM or seek a donor?

Little Bill Verified Driver
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Hey guys I was there,

He was fine, had no complaints, has never had this happen before.

You're all probably right, just a coincidence.

B.S.

The performance enhancers that caused this driver to become sick are not going to be found on the MSDS sheet for the fuel in question.

When my semester is over I will be pushing hard on this.

As I said before, it will be interesting to see who will be willing to give me samples from their tanks after a race, for independent testing.

One more note on this, I am not accusing anyone of intentional wrong doing here. If someone told a driver to run a specific fuel because it produced more power I can see where they might run it.

asennafan
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You guys drove very well and to that I say congrats. I ran right behind you guys for most of Saturdays race (until I got blocked and run into by another driver)and for the most part you guys were very clean drivers. I have been around racing my whole life (31 years) and have been around race gas just as long and you cannot that race gas cannot make you sick. The race gas they used to use during the old IMSA series would make me feel light headed after one whif.

Fix Rim, you are right to say that there is no proof that the gas had anything to do with Bill being sick, but you also have no proof that it did not make him sick either.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the way the gas rules are written race gas is illegal. So wouldn't that make race gas that somone added masking agents to illegal as well regardless of whether it passed tech or not?

--------------------
Shannon J. Sweeney
#0 SM RMDIV

T.J. Kearney Verified Driver
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no dog in this fight, but before you start treading where your toes no longer touch:

http://www.carbon-monoxide-poisoning.com/symptoms.html

--------------------
Tom Kearney
SSM #85
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Drago Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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NO MORE POSTS ON FUEL IN THIS THREAD PLEASE

Please see heading, this was the guys First National win and if you want to talk about fuel, please do so in the other thread that was started.
Thanks
Jim

--------------------
Jim Drago
East Street Auto Salvage
jdrago1@aol.com
2006-2007 Mid-West Division
07,09 June Sprints Champion

EAST STREET RACING

Karl Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
2001 ARRC Winner


Region: SW
Car #: 50
Year : 1600
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I'll be glad to talk about the '99 in the "parity" topic that MB brought back. It may be a few days though. Busy and then I'm off to the Houston GP.

   

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