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Author Topic: SSM discussion thread
Doug Makishima
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Recap of my posts from the original thread:

Original thread here: http://forum.specmiata.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?/topic/26/1013/2.html


As a new SSM driver, I agree there is room for improvement in the sealing process and in compliance. I, for one, would be up for sealing the motor and entire drive train! How about using a reference intake and exhaust for the sealing dyno testing?

FWIW, they did pull two cars after the 1st race at the Thill opener race (mine was one of them), and took them straight to the MCE dyno for compliance testing. Both passed. At Laguna, they checked fuel in the top SSMs.

[added]: I forgot to mention that there was an SCCA tech steward monitoring the entire redyno procedure.

===========

Kevin at MCE told me he seals it at a target of 113.5HP. If the motor in the car is not capable of making that much HP, I do not know what happens.

BTW, I have a dyno sheet of my car from before the sealing, from a different shop. I also have the sheet that Kevin from MCE did just before he sealed it. Both sheets are within .5HP, and are below 120HP. I'd be happy to show them to you if you want. Obviously, I don't have any data from after the sealing process (which I agree is strange). Heck, if you want to dyno my car, I'll
consider that as well.

===========

MCE's Sealing procedure does include replacing the spark plugs. He also tests the fuel. Also, there is a torque spec, but I don't remember what it is.

I agree they should dyno the top 3 SSMs frequently, if not after every race. Like I said earlier, at the Thill race, they dyno'ed my car and one other, and at Laguna they did test fuel. I hear that they (NASA) frequently dyno the BMW Spec E30s.

===========

Talk to me if you want to dyno my car (on your dime).

Also, like I said above, I have two dyno sheets from two different dyno shops prior to my sealing procedure. Both show less than 120HP.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
2004 SCCA SFR Rookie Driver
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Doug Makishima
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Here's a quick summary of my SSM thoughts:

Transparency: Dyno sheets should be made public.

Calibration: All SSMs should be within a tight HP/TQ range (like +/- 1.5hp). This is the whole purpose of a sealed class. The range should be achievable with an inexpensive crate motor. This means the dyno that is used must be calibrated for at least consistency & repeatability. If the target is 114 and cars are all being sealed at 118 because the dyno is reading low, that's actually not a big problem as long as it is repeatable so that all SSMs are within the tight range. However, if 'absolute value' accuracy was achieved, that would put an end to the SSM vs. SMT Pro Motor debate. The debate here should be about "are all SSMs created equal", not SSM vs. SMT.

Sealing Procedure: Use spec fuel, spark plugs/wires, intake and exhaust. If someone uses heavy fluids for the sealing, they will not pass a compliance dyno re-check after they've replaced with normal fluids. In fact, if they've done any funny business for the sealing to achieve higher post-sealing HP, they will be caught in a compliance check.

Compliance: Check often. Re-dyno and weigh podium cars, and 1 or 2 at random. Check seals. Check fuel. Check flywheels. Check, check, check...

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
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Phillip Holifield Verified Driver
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All good points Doug. I think the first step is transparency and compliance. We should dyno a bunch of cars at Thunderhill and make both the original sheets and the compliance check sheets public. Then we can see where we stand and determine what to change in the sealing procedure.

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Also, we need a clear definition of what passes and what fails in compliance checks. Does 1hp over fail? I think there should be some leeway due to factors outside of the drivers control but how far do we allow it to go?

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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From the other thread:

From an outsider's viewpoint:

Sean has some good points. 1) Dyno all cars at the same time would be good. Difference between hot, cold, humid, dry is BIG. 2) and this is an even bigger ? in my mind. Builder can build for good torque and not so good hp. Spend enough and you've got a winner...

This is really far off from what enterprises does for SRF, which is already a 4-5hp crap shoot. And they build the motors, AND dyno them in an environmentally controlled environment.

-bw

--------------------
Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
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Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

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And don't announce when you will do it. ever.
[Confused]

[ 05-22-2010, 09:19 AM: Message edited by: Dr. Dan ]

--------------------
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Doug Makishima
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quote:
Originally posted by B Wilson:
From the other thread:

From an outsider's viewpoint:

Sean has some good points. 1) Dyno all cars at the same time would be good. Difference between hot, cold, humid, dry is BIG. 2) and this is an even bigger ? in my mind. Builder can build for good torque and not so good hp. Spend enough and you've got a winner...

-bw

A good dyno will compensate for temp and humidity.

SFR SSM does have a max torque spec as well. Not sure if it would be possible/practical, but perhaps we need a max HP and max trq profile curve? And, I reiterate my request for spec intake/exhaust.

I agree with Dan. Don't announce when you are going to dyno check. Or, announce it but do it every race for top three finishers.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
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Or you could just adopt the NASA SSM rules I put together... they have a Max HP/TQ and a curve that has to be followed.

Plus a lot more checks for gaming the dyno...

Just saying! [Smile]

--------------------
Jason Holland
Semi-interested civilian

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Doug Makishima:
quote:
Originally posted by B Wilson:
From the other thread:

From an outsider's viewpoint:

Sean has some good points. 1) Dyno all cars at the same time would be good. Difference between hot, cold, humid, dry is BIG. 2) and this is an even bigger ? in my mind. Builder can build for good torque and not so good hp. Spend enough and you've got a winner...

-bw

A good dyno will compensate for temp and humidity.

SFR SSM does have a max torque spec as well. Not sure if it would be possible/practical, but perhaps we need a max HP and max trq profile curve? And, I reiterate my request for spec intake/exhaust.

I agree with Dan. Don't announce when you are going to dyno check. Or, announce it but do it every race for top three finishers.

Too bad good dynos don't exist [Smile]

I've seen too much to know that dynos aren't very consistent, especially with their compensation algorithms. At least it sounds like SFR has only one dyno facility.

No, max is not a good guide. Really needs to be a profile curve.

-bw

--------------------
Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

Viet-Tam Luu
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We discussed people's concerns with SSM at some length at last night's BOD meeting.

I was not able to convince Mike et al that releasing/publishing dyno sheets would be a good idea; I reasoned that it would be better to provide more data and leave less to people's speculation/imagination, but I've yet to sway the BOD's opinion on this particular point. Moreover, releasing/publishing dyno sheets (for newly sealed and passing cars) falls outside of the current SSM contract that SFR has with MCE; it doesn't, as far as I know, prevent MCE from doing so, but the contract exists to make sure every SSM competitor receives exactly the same treatment so I can see why publishing dyno sheets on new seals without being able to do it retroactively for already-sealed cars might be a problem.

Anyway, what we did agree to, in the spirit of improving transparency and increasing competitors' confidence in the process, is to publish the parts of the MCE contract that specify the sealing procedure and specifications; and here they are:

quote:
MCE will perform the dyno process as follows:
1) MCE will supply, gap and install a standard spark plug, Autolite AR3935 gapped at positive electrode end to 0.028 inch +/-0.003 inch.
2) MCE will check for proper oil levels using MCE retained Miata oil dipstick and will check to insure the oil measurement system has not been altered.
3) MCE will tune the SSM engine to target HP target window of 113 HP +/- 1.5 HP and 100 +/- 3 ft lbs of torque by adjusting the distributor and/or the MAF valve, All testing will be performed before engine cooling fan starts at 180į engine temperature.
4) While checking the HP, MCE will look for any indication of an out of range power train drag issue by performing the negative HP test, using Dynojet 224X Dynamometer.
5) A Miata that cannot be raised to meet the HP target will be sealed with the ownerís approval after notification of result.
6) If the Miata fails, the driver will be only told the following; your car could not meet the SSM sealing criteria for the following reason(s):
a. The HP could not be raised to the proper target and was sealed per #5 above.
b. During the dyno process your carís negative HP test was above the target range.

Once the Miata is set for the proper HP target, MCE will perform a sealing process using proprietary color/bar code detection system. The following items will be sealed:
1) Oil pan
2) Valve cover
3) ECM
4) Airflow Sensor
5) Cam Sensor

From time to time SFR will ask MCE to provide compliance testing services. SFR will select the cars to be tested. MCE will validate, that all seals are in place, the car falls in the target HP and negative HP range. MCE will notify the SFR Chief of Tech if the car passes or fails.

The car will fail inspection only if any of the following is determined from the dyno process:
1) The carís HP was above the target levels
2) The carís negative HP was above the target range.
3) If any compliance seals are broken or tampered with.
The SFR Chief of Tech will be told the car failed for which of the above reasons.

MCE will provide an SCCA witness statement and meet with the SOM as required to document the results of the testing for the purpose of assessing penalties. In the event of failure, a copy of the dyno sheet will be supplied to the SFR office.

Also, we intend to direct Impound to more thoroughly inspect seals etc. on SSM cars to verify compliance.

Additionally the BOD intends to look into the matter of SSM-sealed "built" engines, i.e. non-SSM "pro" engines that have been detuned by MCE to conform the SSM limits. It has been anecdotally observed that such engines sometimes do not run very well and it's possible that such engines may perform differently than other crate/stock-engine SSMs. The above procedure does not have explicit provisions for engines that start out above the HP limit and cannot be practically detuned to fall within the allowed range. We will look further into this and may direct MCE to not seal the relatively few engines that fall into this category.

--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

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Mike informs me that even though this is not explicitly specified, MCE does look at the torque and HP curves and doesn't just match the peak numbers to the target. (All of which goes under the headline, "Kevin @ MCE wasn't born yesterday". [Smile] )

--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

Doug Makishima
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Mike told the same thing about looking at the TRQ curves. I'd feel better about a spec max curve profile though.

BTW, he also told me he uses UV ink (with an unknown wavelength) as well as the "Proprietary Color" sealing compound. So, I don't thing you could just buy the same color sealing stuff. Even if you did, you'd get caught on a dyno recheck.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
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Juan Pineda Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Yippie, let's seal with Laguna exhaust!

Tam, so what is the BOD's reason against publishing dyno sheets? Can't be the contract with MCE. They could change that if they wanted to.

-Juan

--------------------
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I personally like to get sealed with my cat. Just sayin.

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quote:
Originally posted by Sean Allen:
I personally like to get sealed with my cat. Just sayin.

And my stock dirty air filter on my Rebello engine..

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faster than the average bear...

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Sean, what you do with your cat in the privacy of your own home is really none of our business...

--------------------
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Juan Pineda Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by DionJ:
quote:
Originally posted by Sean Allen:
I personally like to get sealed with my cat. Just sayin.

And my stock dirty air filter on my Rebello engine..
Soaked... dripping... in oil.

--------------------
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Dean...thanks for using the word "cat" [rolling on floor laughin]

--------------------
-RA


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quote:
Originally posted by Juan Pineda:
Yippie, let's seal with Laguna exhaust!

Way back when I dyno'ed my SMT car with a Springfield Dyno exhaust + extra big-ass Laguna muffler, then removed the muffler and dyno'ed again a few minutes later.

The reading was actually about 1 WHP higher with the Laguna exhaust. 1 WHP is just "noise" in the readings but the point is it made no difference in power.

Of course if your "Laguna exhaust" is a potato in the tailpipe, that's a different matter. [Smile]

--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

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quote:
Originally posted by DionJ:
quote:
Originally posted by Sean Allen:
I personally like to get sealed with my cat. Just sayin.

And my stock dirty air filter on my Rebello engine..
Then you'd better be running a cat and a dirty air filter when you march to the front of the SSM field and they dyno your car...

Again, Kevin @ MCE wasn't born yesterday and knows all about these kind of sandbagging tricks.

--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

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The dyno exists at only 1 of 3 SFR tracks, the margin of error is significant, a failing car will reflect badly on the sealer (has one ever failed?), and we don't get to see the numbers. Of course we're suspicious. The front running cars are using pro motors which is what the class is supposed to prevent. What's the point?

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quote:
Originally posted by DionJ:
The dyno exists at only 1 of 3 SFR tracks, the margin of error is significant, a failing car will reflect badly on the sealer (has one ever failed?), and we don't get to see the numbers. Of course we're suspicious. The front running cars are using pro motors which is what the class is supposed to prevent. What's the point?

+1 [boggled]

--------------------
-RA


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quote:
Originally posted by Viet-Tam Luu:
Way back when I dyno'ed my SMT car with a Springfield Dyno exhaust + extra big-ass Laguna muffler, then removed the muffler and dyno'ed again a few minutes later.

The reading was actually about 1 WHP higher with the Laguna exhaust.

I think this probably speaks more to the difficulty in obtaining accurate dyno measurements and the misplaced confidence that people place on numbers without understanding the errors.

Example: I had MCE recalibrate my car for 91 octane. We did a baseline run with 100 in the tank and it measured under 110HP. Made no sense. Then we switched to 91 and magically the HP went up 4HP. Did the 91 give me a 4HP gain? Kevin was all over it say yup, 91 gives you 4HP. Well the truth is that my lifters take a few runs pump up, and so my initial runs are always low until they get up to spec. Happens every time I put the car on the dyno.

-Juan

--------------------
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Jeremy Pike
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quote:
Originally posted by Doug Makishima:


BTW, he also told me he uses UV ink (with an unknown wavelength) as well as the "Proprietary Color" sealing compound. So, I don't thing you could just buy the same color sealing stuff. Even if you did, you'd get caught on a dyno recheck.

Can someone post a picture of the proprietary color seal? Just for informative purpose.

As for the UV ink. I believe most automotive applications are UV-A which can be seen with a black light. The same one you used in the 60's will work. Will the UV ink stand up to a can of engine cleaner and a washdown?

Maybe this should have been kept secret and to recheck Officials could have pulled the car in the shade and brought out the black light.

I need to quit watching CSI.

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quote:
3) MCE will tune the SSM engine to target HP target window of 113 HP +/- 1.5 HP and 100 +/- 3 ft lbs of torque by adjusting the distributor and/or the MAF valve, All testing will be performed before engine cooling fan starts at 180į engine temperature.
Max torque: 103 (100+3). What does an unmodified crate produce?

-Juan

--------------------
www.ArtOfRoadRacing.com Race Craft Clinic - Thunderhill - 30 Jan 2011

B Wilson Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Juan Pineda:
quote:
Originally posted by Viet-Tam Luu:
Way back when I dyno'ed my SMT car with a Springfield Dyno exhaust + extra big-ass Laguna muffler, then removed the muffler and dyno'ed again a few minutes later.

The reading was actually about 1 WHP higher with the Laguna exhaust.

I think this probably speaks more to the difficulty in obtaining accurate dyno measurements and the misplaced confidence that people place on numbers without understanding the errors.

Example: I had MCE recalibrate my car for 91 octane. We did a baseline run with 100 in the tank and it measured under 110HP. Made no sense. Then we switched to 91 and magically the HP went up 4HP. Did the 91 give me a 4HP gain? Kevin was all over it say yup, 91 gives you 4HP. Well the truth is that my lifters take a few runs pump up, and so my initial runs are always low until they get up to spec. Happens every time I put the car on the dyno.

-Juan

Yup, first couple runs are just to get the car up to temp. Those are dyno tricks that operators learn to make folks "happy" with the results.

-b

--------------------
Bruce Wilson
2010 Oregon Region Champ
2010 Monte Shelton Driver of the Year
2010 25 Hours of Thunderhill E3 and Under 2 liter Overall Champion
Oregon Region SM Class Advisor

Doug Makishima
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quote:
Originally posted by B Wilson:
quote:
Originally posted by Juan Pineda:
quote:
Originally posted by Viet-Tam Luu:
Way back when I dyno'ed my SMT car with a Springfield Dyno exhaust + extra big-ass Laguna muffler, then removed the muffler and dyno'ed again a few minutes later.

The reading was actually about 1 WHP higher with the Laguna exhaust.

I think this probably speaks more to the difficulty in obtaining accurate dyno measurements and the misplaced confidence that people place on numbers without understanding the errors.

Example: I had MCE recalibrate my car for 91 octane. We did a baseline run with 100 in the tank and it measured under 110HP. Made no sense. Then we switched to 91 and magically the HP went up 4HP. Did the 91 give me a 4HP gain? Kevin was all over it say yup, 91 gives you 4HP. Well the truth is that my lifters take a few runs pump up, and so my initial runs are always low until they get up to spec. Happens every time I put the car on the dyno.

-Juan

Yup, first couple runs are just to get the car up to temp. Those are dyno tricks that operators learn to make folks "happy" with the results.

-b

FWIW, when MCE sealed my SSM, he first did a "before" run, and did wait for it to get up to temp. I was standing right here when he did the three runs to ensure consistent results (which they were). And, his result was only .5HP off of a result that I got from another respected dyno facility in the SF Bay Area.

After the "before" runs he did the sealing, which of course I could not witness.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
2004 SCCA SFR Rookie Driver
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Dave McAnaney Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by Viet-Tam Luu:
Then you'd better be running a cat and a dirty air filter when you march to the front of the SSM field and they dyno your car...

Tam, could you point me to the section in the SSM rules that governs post-race dynoing and requires SSMs to meet speced power/torque post-race?

[ 05-27-2010, 07:51 PM: Message edited by: Dave McAnaney ]

--------------------
Dave McAnaney
SM#45 San Francisco Region

Doug Makishima
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Pike:
quote:
Originally posted by Doug Makishima:


BTW, he also told me he uses UV ink (with an unknown wavelength) as well as the "Proprietary Color" sealing compound. So, I don't thing you could just buy the same color sealing stuff. Even if you did, you'd get caught on a dyno recheck.

Can someone post a picture of the proprietary color seal? Just for informative purpose.

As for the UV ink. I believe most automotive applications are UV-A which can be seen with a black light. The same one you used in the 60's will work. Will the UV ink stand up to a can of engine cleaner and a washdown?

Maybe this should have been kept secret and to recheck Officials could have pulled the car in the shade and brought out the black light.

I need to quit watching CSI.

I think you are right about a standard UV bulb illuminating the UV ink because the standard build emits broad spectrum UV light. However, from what I understand, if you use a special bulb or filters that only emit a narrow spectrum (specific wavelength), you will not see the wavelength specific ink that is not in the UV wavelength used by the bulb/filters.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
2004 SCCA SFR Rookie Driver
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Doug Makishima
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quote:
Originally posted by DionJ:
The dyno exists at only 1 of 3 SFR tracks, the margin of error is significant, a failing car will reflect badly on the sealer (has one ever failed?), and we don't get to see the numbers. Of course we're suspicious. The front running cars are using pro motors which is what the class is supposed to prevent. What's the point?

Dion,

I agree that there needs to be more transparency, and more testing. However, the only way to prevent pro motors is to use sealed crate motors, or have a HP/TRQ curve profile spec rather than relying on only Max HP and Max TRQ.

The next chance I get, I am going to get my car redynoed at a different shop to see where I am compared to my results prior to sealing. That way, I will know if the sealing process actually did anything.

BTW, we need better compliance for SM in general, even in SMT. The controversy here in SSM illustrates that SMT has become a class where competitiveness has become a function of dollars spent. Yes, driver skill is still a big component, but in SMT the "arms race" is just as big, if not bigger, issue than SSM.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
2004 SCCA SFR Rookie Driver
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DionJ Verified Driver
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You're right Doug. SSM needs single source engines, spec intake, and spec exhaust. Otherwise, it's not any different than SMT, plus it costs money for sealing and prevents at track repairs....

Viet-Tam Luu
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Year : 1999
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave McAnaney:
quote:
Originally posted by Viet-Tam Luu:
Then you'd better be running a cat and a dirty air filter when you march to the front of the SSM field and they dyno your car...

Tam, could you point me to the section in the SSM rules that governs post-race dynoing and requires SSMs to meet speced power/torque post-race?
From the supps:
quote:
13. SEALED SPEC MIATA (SSM): Sealed Spec Miata is a limited preparation class. To be eligible for
points, trophies and any other rewards, cars must meet all of the rules for Spec Miata T plus the following:
The engine utilized in the car for any session or race shall be sealed by MCE Racing located at Thunderhill
Park, Willows, CA [530-934-3237] or another San Francisco Region designated supplier. The seals installed
on the motor shall be registered by MCE Racing and shall remain intact and untampered with at all times.
Any seal that is missing or damaged is grounds for disqualification from the event.

And from the SSM contract, above:
quote:
From time to time SFR will ask MCE to provide compliance testing services. SFR will select the cars to be tested. MCE will validate, that all seals are in place, the car falls in the target HP and negative HP range. MCE will notify the SFR Chief of Tech if the car passes or fails.

The car will fail inspection only if any of the following is determined from the dyno process:
1) The carís HP was above the target levels
2) The carís negative HP was above the target range.
3) If any compliance seals are broken or tampered with.
The SFR Chief of Tech will be told the car failed for which of the above reasons.

MCE will provide an SCCA witness statement and meet with the SOM as required to document the results of the testing for the purpose of assessing penalties. In the event of failure, a copy of the dyno sheet will be supplied to the SFR office.


--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

Viet-Tam Luu
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quote:
Originally posted by DionJ:
You're right Doug. SSM needs single source engines, spec intake, and spec exhaust. Otherwise, it's not any different than SMT, plus it costs money for sealing and prevents at track repairs....

I think single-source engines negate the need for spec intakes or exhausts, assuming the engines were dyno-tested and sealed separately with some standard rig.

I vaguely recall the first iteration of the SSM program spec'ed a sealed crate engine from a source somewhere near Reno. There weren't many takers due to the expense of buying a sealed engine, having it installed, etc. You may be right that spending ~$2k on a sealed engine is cheaper in the long run but many people don't have that foresight. Moreover, a great fraction of the Spec Miata field are just folks who got into racing because they could just throw a cage and a few other bits in a cheap Miata; convincing them to spend a chunk of money on a sealed engine when they've got a perfectly good one already is going to be a non-starter. They're not the ones who would spend $5k on a pro engine anyway; ask them and they may say that mandating a sealed crate engine for everybody who wants to enter SSM is too high a price to pay to deal with the possibility of a few competitors who have figured out how to spend big bucks to game the system.

--------------------
Viet-Tam Luu (a.k.a. "Tam")
SFR-SCCA #14 ITS
Director, SCCA San Francisco Region

Doug Makishima
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BTW, just because you buy an engine from a builder like Rebello, doesn't mean it is a $6-7K "pro motor". These builders will do a "standard rebuild" for far less money too.

--------------------
2008 SCCA SFR ITS Season Champion
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hoverducky Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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From the supps:
quote:
13. SEALED SPEC MIATA (SSM): Sealed Spec Miata is a limited preparation class. To be eligible for
points, trophies and any other rewards, cars must meet all of the rules for Spec Miata T plus the following:
The engine utilized in the car for any session or race shall be sealed by MCE Racing located at Thunderhill
Park, Willows, CA [530-934-3237] or another San Francisco Region designated supplier. The seals installed
on the motor shall be registered by MCE Racing and shall remain intact and untampered with at all times.
Any seal that is missing or damaged is grounds for disqualification from the event.

And from the SSM contract, above:
quote:
From time to time SFR will ask MCE to provide compliance testing services. SFR will select the cars to be tested. MCE will validate, that all seals are in place, the car falls in the target HP and negative HP range. MCE will notify the SFR Chief of Tech if the car passes or fails.

The car will fail inspection only if any of the following is determined from the dyno process:
1) The carís HP was above the target levels
2) The carís negative HP was above the target range.
3) If any compliance seals are broken or tampered with.
The SFR Chief of Tech will be told the car failed for which of the above reasons.

MCE will provide an SCCA witness statement and meet with the SOM as required to document the results of the testing for the purpose of assessing penalties. In the event of failure, a copy of the dyno sheet will be supplied to the SFR office.

Well, see, that's interesting. We (as competitors) must comply with the rules, including the supps. SFR's contract with MCE has nothing to do with us. So if an SSM dynos higher than the target after a race, but all the seals are in place and untampered with, it _can't_ be DQed under the rules as they are currently written.

No?

Actually, without looking into it too hard, I suspect a Sealed competitor would be within his rights to refuse to allow the car to be dyno tested. There's nothing in the rules about horsepower, so does SFR have a right to check it? It isn't like dyno testing is particularly good on a vehicle.

Scott

Dave McAnaney Verified Driver
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That's exactly the way that I read it, Scott.

--------------------
Dave McAnaney
SM#45 San Francisco Region

   

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