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Author Topic: SoCal: April 26 & 27 @ Buttonwillow - ROLL CALL
SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by Gibscreen:
I like the format where both days have the same schedule. Mainly because if you have a bad race or mechanical prob saturday it won't screw up your sunday race. Plus, it's simple.

Rob this wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that you are sharing your car with your brother and if you screw up he gets penalized the next day. [scratchchin]

I for one like the qualifying race and even the inverted start although it costed me a front end at willow. I believe that at willow we had some "new" people start the race in the first few rows. Jeff Walker for one.

If the standing start is hazardous to the 1.6, then I am in favor of dropping it.

I could see a sunday qualifing race run australian persuit style.

I have to RSVP no for April Race due to keeping the Wife happy and to allow some of the drivers to catch up to me in points. [duck]

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

SWDouglass Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Doesnt it seem strange that Louis is a Junior member?

I have heard that your fastest qualifying times come in the 3rd to 4th laps, and except for the occasional dumb luck, it has proven to be pretty true with the toyos. If everyone else finds that true, we should consider shortening up the qual time to 15 minutes to lengthen the race.

BUt for me the longer the race goes on the worse my finishing position ends up so maybe we should consider a one lap super sprint.

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by SWDouglass:
quote:
Originally posted by Gibscreen:
I like the format where both days have the same schedule. Mainly because if you have a bad race or mechanical prob saturday it won't screw up your sunday race. Plus, it's simple.

Rob this wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that you are sharing your car with your brother and if you screw up he gets penalized the next day. [scratchchin]

I'm not worried about finishing position, just track time. Some people have proposed ditching practice on Sunday, which affects us since each of us takes one day each. If either of us has to get into the car for the first time that weekend and go qualify (or run a qualifying race) we're going to be compromised.

NASA allows Team Racing, which means 2 different people in the same car over the course of a weekend. Therefore I favor keeping the schedules the same over both days, but if need be to lengthen the race, shortening practice and qualy to 15 mins instead of 20.

It also goes along with my personal motto of "Keep It Simple Stupid." There's no reason to have different schedules on each day if we can accomplish the same goals with the same schedule. And even better with a "same schedule" format, you'd not only get a longer race on Sunday, but Saturday too.

And let's not forget that the drivers aren't the only ones affected by a change in schedule over the weekend. Crews, course workers, officials, etc., will all have to abide by a different schedule over the course of 2 days. There's a reason NASA is able to keep to a schedule and SCCA can't seem to.

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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fastest laps are usually set in the first lap.. for us anyway. its like f1, we get that one flying lap [Big Grin] . The walkers arent new to sm, they have been racing scca for a season before this one.

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NO Offense and all due respect to the Walkers, as they are the rabbit I am trying to work up to, I just don't think Jeff has finished 4th before and therefore ever started in the second row.

But of course jonathan, it took an incident and you deciding to go dirt tracking to keep you from the starting in the front.....which brings up a good idea, have the fast guys have to run the bus stop while the others get to use the straight away. WOW the excitement that would cause! But you have to admit it would be interesting!?! I still think you would finish in the top half.

--------------------
31st in the nation. If I could keep the car on the track and put on the oil cap I could be in the top 20.

CLee
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quote:
Originally posted by SWDouglass:
...have the fast guys have to run the bus stop while the others get to use the straight away...

Let me see, BW has more turns than CS..., hmmm...., Jonathan is 3 secs faster on CS (per lap) than many, hmmm, hmmm...., my money is on Jonathan (or William or Austin) he'll still be faster running the bus stop in the 1.6!

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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I don't know what happened at Willow, but I've raced wheel to wheel with both of the Walkers over the last year or so. They started racing SM a few months after I did and they are both VERY good. I'll gladly race wheel to wheel with them anytime...assuming I can keep up with them.

I still owe Jack for beating me to third on the last lap in the SCCA NATIONAL at Cal Speedway in January...in the rain. He was the first So Cal finisher and the first finisher without full wets on. He drove one hell of a race.

Both of the Walkers are great guys and great racers.

I'll say it again. Inverted starts belong at the local figure-8 track. How many times to we really think we can get away with this? I count 5-wide at points.

http://www.edmison.com/edmison/videos/cs080322InvertedStart.wmv

Sure, we "should all be able to handle it", but it only takes someone misanticipating (is that a word?) someone else's next move, or someone not realizing someone else is next to them (look at how fast that changes in the video) and some of us will be out car shopping and others may be out of SM for good.

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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PS. Sorry about that second bump, Don!

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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edmison, i wanna see the rest of that video! that was a great drive by grant to get up that far by the firs turn!

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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It was a great drive by Grant. He literally comes out of nowhere at the start. No bumps, no drafts, and he flew by a bunch of guys. I guess that just proves the old saying..."they run best right before they blow".

Grant drove a great race and stayed at the front through the duration. He's on fire. It's too bad he couldn't stay for Sunday's race.

William also did a great job at the start to get past Weaver and several others. It paid off in the final race. I'll post the whole race and send you a link.

I'm also working on the video of Sunday's last race lap. It's a great battle between you, Clement and I. Inspired by your videos, I've added a soundtrack. I'll send you a link when it's ready.

CLee
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quote:
Originally posted by Robert Edmison:
...I'm also working on the video of Sunday's last race lap. It's a great battle between you, Clement and I...

How about the part where I tried to move the tire wall an extra mm for you guys [Eek!]

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by Clement:
How about the part where I tried to move the tire wall an extra mm for you guys [Eek!]

I clipped that part out because it shows me being a wuss and backing off because I was certain you were going to clobber the thing...Well, that and the song I picked wasn't quite long enough. [rockband]

Justin Hall Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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Wow a very active Buttonwillow thread....how come nobody showed up for the SCCA Double National this past weekend? SM had its own run group and plenty of track time across both days. I havent raced in a field that small since I was karting!

EDIT: Just saw this was in the NASA forum, I was assuming the event being discussed was an SCCA regional. Not trying to start that war again....

--------------------
Justin Hall

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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quote:
Originally posted by Justin Hall:
EDIT: Just saw this was in the NASA forum, I was assuming the event being discussed was an SCCA regional. Not trying to start that war again....

No warring factions here, just racers. [thumbsup]

IMHO it really shouldn’t matter what association or club a racer/team chooses to attend on any given weekend… We should be able to race with whomever and wherever we want withought feeling pressure or alienation (real or perceived). [soapbox]

So, when I get my SCCA license I’ll happily be racing with ya (adding to the back-to-mid pack).

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

Justin Hall Verified Driver Made Donation to Website Series Champ
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I agree with you John, which was the spirit of my initial question - where was everyone?

--------------------
Justin Hall

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http://socal.drivenasa.com/index.php

CLee
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That was discussed in quite a bit of detail on the CalClub board.

Since that thread is long, here's a summary:
Most of us ran strictly with SCCA (CalClub in SoCal) for a long long long long time. Since we are all spending our discretionary incomes, we just want to go with the path of least resistance. NASA came up one even in a discussion and all of us decided to give it a try. And guess what, there were big smiles on everyone face afterward!

So what are there to smile about NASA?
  • Registration: Signup online and you don't even have to stop at registration window at the track to sign waiver and get wrist band
  • NASA does not nickle and dime you to death. SCCA? $1.5 for a sticker, $5 for log book page...
  • Entry free is lower
  • No SM Compliance Fee
  • Gentle bump drafting is ok
  • Free BBQ dinner at the track
  • Weight scale is accurate
  • NASA try different things to try make it fun from Inverted Qual Race (no good) to Standing Starts
  • Toyo Bucks
  • Other Contingencies for 5th thru 10th positions

I am sure I've left out other positives but you get the idea.

So instead of spending hundreds of $ this past weekend at BW National, I had lunch with some friends, strolled around beautiful La Jolla Cove and Downtown San Diego, took a ferry to Coronado for coffee and cake. I think I spent a whopping $30, maybe $50 if you count gas money.

Are we going to run with CalClub/SCCA again? Sure, but most of us budgeted to run just once a month, so the schedule says NASA for now.

Mark Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Racing - expensive. Watching daughter compete in her first solo dance competition - absolutely priceless. The race calendar seems to be working against me this year [Frown] .

--------------------
Mark
http://www.ironcanyonmotorsports.com

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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THIS MIGHT GET A FEW MORE CARS OUT TO BW THIS MONTH: $$$ BW April '08 $$$

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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Hey SoCal SM'ers I've got three things for ya...

#1. "Supersize" has just activated for this event. Six PT sessions for $135 is a bargain, please take advantage of it.

#2. Don't forget about the extra $$$ Mazda has up from grabs for this event. MAZDA CA$H

#3. So far the below 9 SM's are registered. Please help us out and register ASAP so we can solidify everything.

> Clement Lee
> Jeremy Barnes
> Andrew Fernandez
> Angela Swan
> Jonathan Christian
> Bill Nelson
> Jeff Jeppesen
> Don Thibaut
> Preston Lerner


Check here for details and to register: SoCal April BW Event Reg

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

Preston Lerner Verified Driver
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Hi, John:

Good news about the supersize option. I've got a few quick questions: This means that Spec Miata will be eligible in two run-groups, correct? What cars will it be running with, and does it run as a SM in both groups or SM in one and PTE in the other?

I don't want to start a flame war here, and I'm not taking sides in the NASA-versus-SCCA conflict. For the record, I've had nothing but excellent experiences with both organizations. But imho, one of the great benefits of racing with Cal Club is having a run-group dedicated to SM. I know this wasn't an issue at Fontana, and I'm told there were no problems at Willow Springs. But Buttonwillow has several long sections where it's impossible to pass, which can be really annoying when there are multiple classes running at significantly different speeds, and racing on a configuration featuring the Bus Stop is going to make things even more frustrating. Just my two cents.

While I'm on my soapbox, YES to a Sunday qualifying race, NO to an inverted start and NO to a standing start. (We've already replaced one diff.) But YES to a splitter before heading out for the pace lap. In my last race, there was some serious confusion about who belonged where, and I lost several positions even before reaching the start-finish line.

Preston Lerner

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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For supersize, you'll run SM for the SM race and PTE in the PTE race.

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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preston as much as i like having our own run group i think its fun sometimes to race with other cars, it throws in a new twist to things

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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Think of it this way, if you aspire to race in a pro series, chances are you'll be racing with different cars anyway. Call it practice.

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

GW
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count me in but I'll just be running Fri practice and Sunday, thanks to Louis as I'll be running Don's blue car. just came off the dyno at 125+ so lookout !! [Smile]

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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quote:
Originally posted by Preston Lerner:
Good news about the supersize option. I've got a few quick questions: This means that Spec Miata will be eligible in two run-groups, correct? What cars will it be running with, and does it run as a SM in both groups or SM in one and PTE in the other?

I don't want to start a flame war here.... But imho, one of the great benefits of racing with Cal Club is having a run-group dedicated to SM.

...But Buttonwillow has several long sections where it's impossible to pass, which can be really annoying when there are multiple classes running at significantly different speeds, and racing on a configuration featuring the Bus Stop is going to make things even more frustrating. Just my two cents.

... In my last race, there was some serious confusion about who belonged where, and I lost several positions even before reaching the start-finish line.

Preston Lerner

Preston;
Thanks for posting!!!

For this event SM's are in Race Group A (with HC), I assume it will be a split start but as of 1pm yesterday there were a total of 9 SM's & 7 HC cars (so who knows). If one goes "Supersize" you'd be in Race group C running PTE class. Here is the provisional SCHEDULE


[soapbox]

Now no flaming from me either but your position on the starting grid is your responsibility. Know your starting spot number & which cars are in front & behind you... Heck, I don't know maybe even talk to them before you get in the car to see if you can work together.

Yep, its cool that CalClub has an entire group for SM's and I'm confident that SoCal NASA would too if we constantly have 40+ SM entrants (did I mention only 9 have signed-up so far)... Personally I dig running with other types of cars, but I'd pick 40 SMs over sharing w/ HC any day! [Smile] Until then, I don't see a problem running with other small-bore classes on any track. Learning how to pass (patience) and how to get passed is a skill. Now the BW BusStop will be challenging but prior to running-up-on a slower car you can by adjust entry to get a good run on exit making a pass in Riverside do'able (not that I have the skill to pull it off [Big Grin] ).

Lastly, Ryan is still a little unsure of exactly how everything will work (mainly due to the current small car counts). HOWEVER, I have made it very clear that standing starts for SM's will eventually turn out bad (blown diffs) & that inverted Qual Races should be reevaluated (even thought I personally dig it).

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

CLee
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quote:
Originally posted by Preston Lerner:
...In my last race, there was some serious confusion about who belonged where, and I lost several positions even before reaching the start-finish line....

Someone, not from our region, who was up front, I shall not name names here but you can probably figure it out, refused to move into his position when it was time to pair up, probably because he wanted the inside line, despite "prodding" from his adjacent competitors.

Everyone of us who qualified behind him stayed inline and waited for a long long time for him to move over to pair up. Obivously he didn't and all those in line began to back fill the open slot just before we got onto the straight for the green flag.

That probably meant if you were originally on the left (inside), now you have to be on the right (outside) and vice versa. Those of us who saw what that person did knew we had to swap in order to pair up. It was almost certain there were chaos further back and must be wondering what the fxxx was going on up front.

A splitter would have no effect on that guy. He would have done the same thing and caused the same confusion.

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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Yup.. that was particularly annoying considering that competitor did it on purpose to get the inside line.

i like the schedule btw, we get to go home early sunday.

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quote:
Originally posted by Clement:
Someone, not from our region, who was up front, I shall not name names here but you can probably figure it out...

The only way to get this type of behavior to change is to call them out, at least with the officials. Public floggings work even better though. [Big Grin]

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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quote:
Originally posted by Clement:
Everyone of us who qualified behind him stayed inline and waited for a long long time for him to move over to pair up. Obviously he didn't and all those in line began to back fill the open slot just before we got onto the straight for the green flag.

Preston,
Sorry, I had no idea this went on... I guess thats the advantage of starting way in back [Big Grin]

J

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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Thanks everyone for signing-up over the weekend, big ups Mark for going with the Supersize option.


1. Jeremy Barnes
2. William Christian
3. Jonathan Christian
4. Austin Christian
5. Robert Edmison
6. Andrew Fernandez
7. James Irey
8. Jeff Jeppesen
9. Clement Lee
10. Preston Lerner
11. Alan Leukhardt
12. Bill Nelson
13. Mark Nichols (SUPERSIZED)
14. Angela Swan
15. Don Thibaut

BTW: Stick around after the Saturdays fun-in-the-sun to watch RJ Racing (aka The Gibson Brothers) race for WERC glory. Get'em guys, good luck on the Kumhos [thumbsup]

Thanks again to you all, oh and to Luis too !!

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by GW:
count me in but I'll just be running Fri practice and Sunday, thanks to Louis as I'll be running Don's blue car. just came off the dyno at 125+ so lookout !! [Smile]

dons 1.6 made 125+ [Eek!] [help]

Bobby C
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quote:
Originally posted by GW:
count me in but I'll just be running Fri practice and Sunday, thanks to Louis as I'll be running Don's blue car. just came off the dyno at 125+ so lookout !! [Smile]

Thats almost as good as Tim Weaver's 131hp!!! [duck]

Bobby

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Not gonna make it this time. Uncle Sam took a bite out of my tiny racing budget.

Willow?

--------------------
Tim Buck

MAZDASPEED Motorsports Development
Mazda North American Operations
phone (800) 435-2508
fax (949) 222-2650

zoom-zoom!

GW
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Actually Don's car was only 109 on the dyno. He sure did a good job at Cal Speed with only that!

Fortunately Louis did his magic tuning and got 4 or 5 more for the weekend.

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by Bobby C:
quote:
Originally posted by GW:
count me in but I'll just be running Fri practice and Sunday, thanks to Louis as I'll be running Don's blue car. just came off the dyno at 125+ so lookout !! [Smile]

Thats almost as good as Tim Weaver's 131hp!!! [duck]

Bobby

i heard it was more in the range of valafars 135 [Eek!] [rolling on floor laughin]

Tim Weaver
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Thanks a lot guys. Haven't logged on in a few weeks. My ears must have been burning this morning. According to NASA's dyno 118 is a little closer to reality, maybe a little car swapping might be fun, those CERT 99's are looking pretty fast and everybody knows Bobby's middle name is motor.

Anyways, you guys have a good race this weekend, sorry I won't be able to make it. Already booked this weekend before we decided to run the NASA program.

Bobby, Which Nor-cal event should Grant and I roll up there to run with you?

Tim

Bobby C
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Tim,
Come up and run the June 27th-29th event at Laguna. It is a Double Regional and should be a blast..Bring your sweetie pie since Laguna is a great place to hang out...
There is a rumor flying around that some Larry's from the SE are coming down to whoop on us West Coast guys....... [shame]

Call me

Bobby 925-575-6081

Tim Weaver
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Sounds good with me Bobby, I'll hit up Grant. Any of you other guys in for a Laguna run?

Tim

Jonathan Christian Verified Driver
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quote:
Originally posted by Tim Weaver:
Thanks a lot guys. Haven't logged on in a few weeks. My ears must have been burning this morning. According to NASA's dyno 118 is a little closer to reality, maybe a little car swapping might be fun, those CERT 99's are looking pretty fast and everybody knows Bobby's middle name is motor.

Anyways, you guys have a good race this weekend, sorry I won't be able to make it. Already booked this weekend before we decided to run the NASA program.

Bobby, Which Nor-cal event should Grant and I roll up there to run with you?

Tim

[burst] probably wont be able to make it to laguna, is grant still trying to go to the nasa runoffs?

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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quote:
Originally posted by Tim Weaver:
Sounds good with me Bobby, I'll hit up Grant. Any of you other guys in for a Laguna run?

Tim

We were already planning on heading up for that. Nice to know we'll have a SoCal contingent.

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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quote:
Originally posted by sn8byte:
Thanks everyone for signing-up over the weekend, big ups Mark for going with the Supersize option.
1. Jeremy Barnes
2. William Christian
3. Jonathan Christian
4. Austin Christian
5. Robert Edmison
6. Andrew Fernandez
7. James Irey
8. Jeff Jeppesen
9. Clement Lee
10. Preston Lerner
11. Alan Leukhardt
12. Bill Nelson
13. Mark Nichols (SUPERSIZED)
14. Angela Swan
15. Don Thibaut

BTW: Stick around after the Saturdays fun-in-the-sun to watch RJ Racing (aka The Gibson Brothers) race for WERC glory. Get'em guys, good luck on the Kumhos [thumbsup]

Thanks again to you all, oh and to Luis too !!

Thanks to William Christian II we've now got 16 SM registered for this event. Ryan will be closing down registration tomorrow morning (Thur 24th), so if you know anyone who was planning on attending but has not yet drop'em a email or something. Supersize is still available too.

Have a great time everyone and we'll see ya in May @ Willow.

--------------------
Thanks,
John Mueller
NASA SM National Director
http://www.Weekend-Racer.com
#13 "Tiger Miata" - 2009 SoCal SSM Champion

John Mueller Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Okay, not the slowest anymore...

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I also forgot to mention two things:

1. For this event, the Saturday AND Sunday sprint race starting order will be determined by your fastest lap during the qualifying sessions (no qualf race this event).

2. While he WERC Enduro guys are getting ready to roll there will be a BBQ & beverages served for all to enjoy.

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
"Bring out zee gimp!"     - Max Mosley

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Has a schedule been published yet? If so, can someone direct me to it?


Thanks,

Robert Edmison

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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http://socal.drivenasa.com/events/sched-bw-april08.pdf

For future reference, schedules can be found on the Event Registration page for that event. They're usually posted a week before the event. And a confirmation email is sent a few days before the race.

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

Robert Edmison Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
"Bring out zee gimp!"     - Max Mosley

Region: CSCC
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Thanks Rob!

It looks like the Event Registration page for April has already been removed. Either that or I'm blind...

http://www.nasaproracing.com/nasa_event/list_events

I didn't receive an e-mail confirmation with a schedule (yet?) either.

Thanks again for your help.

Gibscreen Verified Driver Series Champ
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Mueller and Douglass, the two co-directors of SM, are not going to be at the track this weekend, so Ryan and I have talked about me being the go-between for any issues. Ryan is always available directly, but if you'd like me to address anything, please let me know and I'll see what can be done asap.

For anyone who doesn't know me, I'm in the Orange and Blue #23.

Rob

--------------------
Rob Gibson
RJ Racing
2010 NASA Nationals TTE Champion
2008/2009 WERC Champion
2007 NASA SoCal SM Champion
rjracing.net
Weekend-Racer.com

 
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