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Author Topic: JULY SPRINTS WGI 7/23,24,25
Adam Figarsky
Member

Region: mo-hud
Car #: 32
Year : 1990
Posts: 170
Status: Offline
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registration is up
-
registration link--- ----

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TeamFigMented

2009 NARRC and NYSRRC SSM Champion
2009 SSM NESCCA Enduro Series Champion

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
Status: Offline
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All of a sudden a 12-lap race seems so short.....

Signed up for SSM. May sign up for SM as well. Plan on doing the test day since I haven't been up to the glen yet this year.

--------------------
http://www.volko.com

GridWench
Member

Region: Glen
Posts: 44
Status: Offline
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We look forward to having you both here! [Smile]
If there is anything I can help you with, let me know. And save the date for the Last Chance at WGI...October 8-10.

Cheryl

--------------------
Cheryl Ragalevsky
Glen Region, SCCA
Activities Director
Membership Chair
Chair, Last Chance

CP Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 7
Year : 1999
Posts: 636
Status: Offline
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Some of LTD Racing will be there for 3 days as well.

--------------------
-Cy
Supported by LTD Racing & Speed Shack - New England's Premier Auto Accessory Store
Rt1 AutoMile - Norwood, MA
http://www.speedshackonline.com

Zack Skolnick
Member

Region: NNJR
Car #: 89
Year : 1993
Posts: 43
Status: Offline
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I will be there racing in the SM class

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Zack Skolnick #89
Rossini Race Products/ Piloti /Zamp Racing Helmets/ Playseat USA
http://www.rossiniracing.com

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
Status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by CP:
Some of LTD Racing will be there for 3 days as well.

Jeff you going to make this one? I was looking forward to racing you in SM at the last chance last year, and then the bottom fell out.

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http://www.volko.com

FastM3 Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 38
Year : 90
Posts: 105
Status: Offline
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We are planning to be there. Not sure what classes we will run. We have a room but still need to get registered.

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Phil
Silver 38 SM/ITA

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
Status: Offline
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SSM is going to be fun! Ed Z with the local knowledge, Adam F back in SSM making sure no one takes his track record away, and Mike Treble-8 fresh off a strong drive at NJMP. Something tells me I'll wind up stuck in ITB traffic trying to keep these guys in my sights.

--------------------
http://www.volko.com

Adam Figarsky
Member

Region: mo-hud
Car #: 32
Year : 1990
Posts: 170
Status: Offline
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Adam "be dat" figarsky..might, just might do sm instead...only 11 cars in ssm regional and 2 in Pro-IT... wtf

--
cant wait to draft...
--
records are made to be broken...vick...

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TeamFigMented

2009 NARRC and NYSRRC SSM Champion
2009 SSM NESCCA Enduro Series Champion

edzeb
Member

Region: Glen
Car #: #72
Year : 1990/1991/1992
Posts: 316
Status: Offline
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Lightning McQueen is up and running. Check your mirrors entering the chicane!

Adam Figarsky
Member

Region: mo-hud
Car #: 32
Year : 1990
Posts: 170
Status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by edzeb:
Lightning McQueen is up and running. Check your mirrors entering the chicane!

..."the chicane"...

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TeamFigMented

2009 NARRC and NYSRRC SSM Champion
2009 SSM NESCCA Enduro Series Champion

soupy
Member

Region: Mohud
Car #: 98
Year : 1999
Posts: 915
Status: Offline
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Should we be looking for the front of the car or the side?
I know "my bad"

--------------------
Charlie Campbell
Race Engineering
carbotech brakes

edzeb
Member

Region: Glen
Car #: #72
Year : 1990/1991/1992
Posts: 316
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Well don't look for the ride side of the car!

Zack Skolnick
Member

Region: NNJR
Car #: 89
Year : 1993
Posts: 43
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Did anyone pick up a copy of the official pro-it qualfying results they can post on here? Also, who did what in the afternoon qualfying regular sm race?

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Zack Skolnick #89
Rossini Race Products/ Piloti /Zamp Racing Helmets/ Playseat USA
http://www.rossiniracing.com

CP Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 7
Year : 1999
Posts: 636
Status: Offline
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I got porked by someone who drives with no regard for anyone's safety. Time and again he has demonstrated this. He drives like an ahole, just like I told him two weeks ago at New Hampshire after running a buddy of mine off the track. His car had some damage but he'll be back for the next race.

There is lots of in-car footage of the incident from behind which I've seen, but here's my view: http://www.vimeo.com/13611272

I'm done for the season and in the hole for the cost of a Spec Miata. I apologize to those involved to have been the car in front, but I got turned and was along for the ride after that. I know someone went to the hospital after being knocked unconscious and we all hope you're alright. Thanks to all that stopped by the see if I was ok. Dick Padula: thanks for your help with the tow truck and verbal support. I appreciated it.

People need to understand that this AMATEUR racing that we do is full of give and take; it needs to happen. I can't tell you how many positions I've given up this season with the safety of my fellow racers and condition of my car in mind. A half second breath of the throttle could save alot of cars at merely the cost of a position. Unlike the crash in the bus stop two weeks ago at the Glen National, this incident today could have been avoided had level heads prevailed.

--------------------
-Cy
Supported by LTD Racing & Speed Shack - New England's Premier Auto Accessory Store
Rt1 AutoMile - Norwood, MA
http://www.speedshackonline.com

Chris Outzen
Junior Member

Region: NER
Posts: 2
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Sorry to hear this Cy.. Maybe Dave can work his magic on your car and get you back out this year.

Adroitracer Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 80
Year : 99
Posts: 100
Status: Offline
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Wow, that really sucks! Sorry Cy.

--------------------
Sponsors: Masy Systems, Inc (Validation/calibration/biostorage). http://www.masy.com
nanoCLEAN (Cleanroom cleaning services). http://www.nanoclean.us

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
Status: Offline
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I had a pretty good view of the acccident as it unfolded. It shows Cy getting turned and spinning up the esses. It doesn't show the fourth miata (the black and red 85) getting collected in the aftermath. That car looks totaled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mphsqvfa7uc

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http://www.volko.com

CP Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 7
Year : 1999
Posts: 636
Status: Offline
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There's the cause right there. They don't even go 3 wide in NASCAR on that portion of track. The start should have been waved off. I can't believe I didn't get hurt. I was waiting for someone to come crashing through my passenger door as I spun acorss the track. It felt like it took 30 seconds for me to cross the track in front of half the field...funny how the mind slows things down and you've got time to really think. Keith clipped the front of my car instead of spearing me, thankfully.

--------------------
-Cy
Supported by LTD Racing & Speed Shack - New England's Premier Auto Accessory Store
Rt1 AutoMile - Norwood, MA
http://www.speedshackonline.com

disquek Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Veteran Member

Region: New England
Car #: 92
Posts: 1993
Status: Offline
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In 2006 the same person made the same move with the same result.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ga21CsLJ-Sc

-Kyle

Adroitracer Verified Driver
Member

Region: NER
Car #: 80
Year : 99
Posts: 100
Status: Offline
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That start was a mess.... What happened up front to get everyone so bottled up?

I know this has been brought up in the past, but how about adopting a grand-am style of start. Wouldn't that stop the people from jumping the start to make up 10 positions they didn't earn in qualifying?

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Sponsors: Masy Systems, Inc (Validation/calibration/biostorage). http://www.masy.com
nanoCLEAN (Cleanroom cleaning services). http://www.nanoclean.us

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
Status: Offline
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Anyone know what was said in the drivers meeting? (I missed it because was racing in ssm). I heard they apologized for the start.

The start on sunday was waved off. Would love to know what we looked like as a field.

--------------------
http://www.volko.com

BKJ Verified Driver
Member

Region: MoHud
Car #: 08
Year : 1992
Posts: 43
Status: Offline
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I don't usually post, but since this one hit close to home .. I think I will. The SM class has become a huge disappointment for many folks I know for one reason ... it is no longer a spec class... yet it is touted as one. What it really has become is a class where you can spend as much money as you want on your race engine and go out on the track with little to no talent and wreak havoc. It is no longer a class to showcase your driving skills, but highlight the size of your wallet.

My father is doing fine after 5 hours in the hospital ... he will be back at the track soon.

[ 07-25-2010, 08:37 PM: Message edited by: BKJ ]

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BKJ
BK Motorsports

"The other night I went to a Demolition Derby and a Spec Miata race broke out"

CP Verified Driver
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Region: NER
Car #: 7
Year : 1999
Posts: 636
Status: Offline
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I'm glad that your father is doing well BKJ.

--------------------
-Cy
Supported by LTD Racing & Speed Shack - New England's Premier Auto Accessory Store
Rt1 AutoMile - Norwood, MA
http://www.speedshackonline.com

Kent Carter Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Future Never Has Been

Region: Houston
Car #: 91
Year : 1991
Posts: 2171
Status: Offline
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It is a major, major flaw in the system when cars can be destroyed and drivers hospitalized without the stewards asking 'Hey! What happened out there?'

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Do I turn my 99 Hard S into a killerfast SM or seek a donor?

breathesfire Verified Driver
flirting with disaster

Region: South Jersey
Year : 91
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Kent Carter:
It is a major, major flaw in the system when cars can be destroyed and drivers hospitalized without the stewards asking 'Hey! What happened out there?'

+1

Pete Maerz

JIM46
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Region: MOHUD
Car #: 46
Year : 1995
Posts: 14
Status: Offline
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Glad you will be ok BK. It would be a shame if we didn't learn anything from this. People need to remember we have an obligation to take care of each other out there. Just out of curiosity I would love to hear from the 22. This way he could explain what his thoughts were. While keeping in mind he sent a friend to the hospital. We all take the track with an assumed risk involved, but this was a 100% preventable.

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JIMSSM46/MOHUD
Planet Miata

Adam Figarsky
Member

Region: mo-hud
Car #: 32
Year : 1990
Posts: 170
Status: Offline
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BK!!!....glad you're ok....
I saw the entire incident unfold...knew it was a big hit...again glad you're ok, along with everyone else...
hell of a start by the way...
-----
PRO-IT- half dry / half downpour
Kevin Gleason
David Lendrum
Jimmy Locke
-
SM Race
Gleason
Soupy
David Lendrum
-------
Meeting-
Steward began with apology for start then said SM behavior has to change and then preached about the HANS device...She then left...
-------
Start of SM RACE (sunday)- I was DFL...field looked fine, no worse than any other event start; I think they waved it off just for the sake of waving it off or to show that they could...is there such thing as a make-up call in racing?
-------
BKjr...agree with you entirely...
-------
TONY-Thanks for letting me borrow the car...also, ended up running the Pro-IT and SM races...solution=hammer strike to shifter knob and don't shift into 5th...WTF?!

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TeamFigMented

2009 NARRC and NYSRRC SSM Champion
2009 SSM NESCCA Enduro Series Champion

edzeb
Member

Region: Glen
Car #: #72
Year : 1990/1991/1992
Posts: 316
Status: Offline
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SM'ers I was on top of the tower (in the crow's next) for the SM Sunday start. For what it is worth there where two Stewards up there as starting judges.
Help the Stewards, if someone has to get the message, relearn, or just GO, THROW PAPER at them.
As for the SSM race, good fun and thanks to all for some good racing. Saturday I was working to catch Sheridan (never thought you'd see that!).
Speaking as RE of the Glen Region, thanks to everyone and let me know what you thought of the event.
As for WGI, FUN ONE HERE WE COME!
--Ed...

Kent Carter Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Future Never Has Been

Region: Houston
Car #: 91
Year : 1991
Posts: 2171
Status: Offline
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Ed, I reiterate: 'throwing paper' isn't the answer. Stewardship is. You cannot call yourselves 'stewards' if you don't tell the drivers 'bring your video cameras to the office, we are going to find out what happened here!' after an incident like this.

The race is over, the winners have been congratulated. Now it is time for the stewards to go to work. A Driver's Review (under Section 2.4 of the GCR) must be done. All the video and witness statements regarding this incident must be reviewed. The outcome of the review should not just focus on the person who is at 'fault' but on all the factors that led to the incident.

A protest is NOT the way to handle this.

--------------------
Do I turn my 99 Hard S into a killerfast SM or seek a donor?

d mathias Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Member

Region: OVR
Car #: 88
Year : 1991
Posts: 2401
Status: Offline
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Not sure what happened but when I first started racing with the SCCA 9 years ago if you had metal-to-metal contact you got called to the principal's office, and oh yeah, pull your car over to tech and bring your logbook, we want to make a few notes.

The last few years nothing happens unless you throw paper, and even then I feel like the stewards just wish I would go away.

T.J. Kearney Verified Driver
Male Member

Region: Finger Lakes
Car #: 85
Year : 1992
Posts: 755
Status: Offline
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A few thoughts from this weekend:

- setting up in the rain sucks, but racing in it is fun

- why not a double? I cannot fathom any reasoning against (knowing the track rental fees) and know this impacts car counts

- why not a reduced entry for same driver in another class (this would help car counts)

- No t-shirt? No pen? Not even a key chain? Come on [Big Grin]

- the stale pretzels and Chex mix was quite a letdown. Next year save the Glen catering fees and give entrants/workers a t-shirt instead [duck]

- the FM transmitter still doesn't work....but it doesn't matter because you cant understand a word the gentleman announcer says (even when you're within earshot of a speaker)

- the SSM pace car driver on Saturday deserves an F1 seat...holy crap

Other than my bit of whining, it was fun racing with the folks I was around....thanks for the rain tips Jim! [Big Grin]

--------------------
Tom Kearney
SSM #85
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

kevin 22 Verified Driver
Member

Region: NYR
Car #: 22
Year : 1991
Posts: 270
Status: Offline
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Saturday after the accident I was not sure what had happened. It happens so fast and your memory of what happened is never accurate. But Saturday Night I reviewed my Video. I realized where the accident started. Sunday Morning at tried to seek out anyone involved to show my video & offer apoligies. I finally reached BK today and we talked.
I will post my video as well since it will clearly show what happened.
As for an explaination, I had a good run coming out of turn 1. As I approached BK, I did intend to follow him, you can hear me lift. But just as I aproach him it appeared to me that he moved right and I would be able to go right by. But as soon as I had a fender inside him the space closed and the rest needs no explanation. I feel terrible for what happened to everyone involved.
http://vimeo.com/13650677


I had no intentions of explaining myself to the forum, I tried to speak with those invloved. But I think it is very unfair for Cy to imply that there is a pattern. NHMS incident was clearly CY's fault, it is actually a bit hypocrital for him to bring it up I will post that video as well. He made it 3 wide and then blamed me afterwards. Watch the video Someone gets a run on me going into the oval, I slow and give the inside, we end up side by side going into turn 3, CY Peake is behind us and able to get a run on both of us , he makes it 3 wide going into turn 3. He aborts the attempt but then get hit from someone else , you have to watch all of the action in my mirror to see what happens. But after the race I was yelled at and accused of causing his wreck.I take no blame for his misfortune here.
http://vimeo.com/13651580
I have no bad feelings towards CY, I believe he is a talanted driver, as aggresive as anyone, I just believe he likes to always believe it is someone else fault. Clearly he was correct at WGI. He was a victim there. But I take offense to his comments & his actions at impound about NHMS.

I will fix my car and be back, I have learned something, as I do from every incident. I learn form the good moments and the bad, When its my fault and the fault of others. I hope we never have to discuss an incident again.

--------------------
Kevin Anderson

edzeb
Member

Region: Glen
Car #: #72
Year : 1990/1991/1992
Posts: 316
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Kent,

What I am saying is that if drivers are unwilling to throw paper, then you leave it up to the observations of the corner workers to make the first call on blame. If the corner worker states that it is a 'racing incident' on the metal to metal, then what is a Steward to do? Bring the drivers in and question them against the judgement of the cornerworkers?
What is obvious to you and what you see, may NOT be what the cornerworker sees. This is why as drivers we need to step up to the plate and throw paper if need be. Cornerworkers can not see everything. Stewards are not on the track or at the corner stations.
So if we proceed with the idea of Stewards pulling people in due to any contact, and Johnny says Jimmy did it, and Jimmy says Johnny did it and the cornerworker says it was just a racing incident, then what?
Did I like that there was an assigned SM Steward in the past, YES.
But what I like even more is the the drivers in the incident have spoken to each other. Some of you may remember my car's 17 second long 3-hour enduro a few years ago. My biggest complaint regarding that incident? The other driver never came up to our team after it happened, even to tell his side of the story. But I located him on line after the event and we talked.
It's club racing folks, YOU have the power.

BKJ Verified Driver
Member

Region: MoHud
Car #: 08
Year : 1992
Posts: 43
Status: Offline
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I have a suggestion that I think will work well ... require every SM driver to have a camera on board so there is video of every incident (just tack on $350 dollars to the $10k motor price). Any accident that causes more than $500 dollars of damage goes to a peer review the same day as the race. The Peer group is made up of a random draw out of the rest of the SM drivers. The decision of that group is final .... and they should have the ability to suspend driving privileges. Only then will the contact stop.

Protests don't work because there are no real teeth and they are handled by SCCA officials. It is time for a little peer policing. If 5 guys who have to get on the track with you say "take a break" that is going to register.

This is a hobby ... it is supposed to be fun. Here is how much fun I have had the last 2 weekends I spent at SCCA events.

Limerock 3 weeks ago ... Major wreck in the downhill in early laps because folks who had no business passing or even attempting to pass on the downhill decided they had the talent to pull it off. Result ... 1 car flip a bunch of times with luckily minimal injuries and an entire race run under yellow. $300 dollars for a ride around the track

And then the incident at Watkins Glen ... more carnage by folks who had no respect for each other, a race start that even a half blind person would have waved off, and again another $300 ride around under yellow. All while wondering which ambulance they just loaded my father in.

When I first started racing in this class, I was proud because the folks who do well in SM are some of the best drivers out there. Now we are a collective joke ... and we have allowed that to happen. Other classes don't have these issues, other classes rarely see the carnage of an SM race.

I don't believe we race for trophies (I have seen them and they are not that great), I believe we race for respect ... and whether you come in 1st or 31st ... you can still win respect. At the end of the day, we should all go home safe, enthusiastic about our hobby, and excited to see each other next week ... I for one have not felt that way in a long time leaving an SCCA event!

--------------------
BKJ
BK Motorsports

"The other night I went to a Demolition Derby and a Spec Miata race broke out"

Kent Carter Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Future Never Has Been

Region: Houston
Car #: 91
Year : 1991
Posts: 2171
Status: Offline
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Ed,

One of us has it wrong, but I'll start with where we agree: It is wonderful that the drivers talked it over.

1. The corner workers (being one myself) are usually irrelevant to finding out what went wrong in a big crash like this.
2. The drivers involved are often useless in finding out what went wrong in a big crash like this. Their views are distorted by limited vision, distraction and bias.
3. The facts are on video and many drivers carry video.
4. Other drivers often have great insights into what happened but often can't identify the cars very exactly.

I know some neanderthal steward-like fossil is going to trot out the 30 minute rule, but that is just for protests that affect the outcome of the race. This is bigger than that.

GCR 2.4 is the pathway for investigating the cause of incidents like this and for driver improvement. The Stewards have the power -- and responsibility -- to gather evidence and apply corrections.

If the Stewards were doing their jobs in this case, each driver would be asked, "Did you see the incident? What happened? Got it on video?" The videos would be collected and viewed whenever the Stewards had time (over a beer at someone's house even) along with driver statements and the drivers that needed coaching would get called for a Driver's Review per GCR 2.4. That said, I am NOT a fan of punitive measures in general. We are all amateurs and kicking people off the island for bad driving would simply lead to an empty island. Use it as a teaching tool for ALL drivers. Don't you look at these Vimeo and YouTube videos of mistakes and learn from them? I do!

--------------------
Do I turn my 99 Hard S into a killerfast SM or seek a donor?

disquek Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Veteran Member

Region: New England
Car #: 92
Posts: 1993
Status: Offline
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Kevin,

You and I have been over this ground before. I doubt I'll get any further this time. But it's worth a try because one of your mistakes sent a friend to the hospital.

Without going into the details, ask yourself this on a high level; "Do you get into wrecks often ... more often than most?"

If you answer "yes" (and if you don't, you're delusional), you have to ask why.

Is you car magnetic? Were you a car crusher operator in a previous life?

The answer is simple. You take low percentage chances where you should not.

No one thinks that you do it on purpose. The issue is that when a low percentage chance arises, you take it where others would not. Those chances often end badly. This is a perfect example.

Remember, you're racing for 14th place in a regional. I doubt anyone will remember who won this race in a week, let alone who finished 13th.

Take it down a notch Man. Beat people on pure pace, not on opportunistic chances taken on L1 T1 that often ruin other peoples weekend. You'll enjoy your success more when you earn it rather than when you fall into it.

-Kyle

kevin 22 Verified Driver
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Region: NYR
Car #: 22
Year : 1991
Posts: 270
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Kyle I am racing the same car now for 6 seasons, never having to change more then the Occaional door or fender like everyone else. Same front bumper, same hood, same quarters, same car. 6 seasons now. Aside from the occasional rub, This has never happened before

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Kevin Anderson

soupy
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Region: Mohud
Car #: 98
Year : 1999
Posts: 915
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Kevin, and a lot of others need to stop making excuses and listen to what Kyle is saying. A lot of us have had enough and we are going to find a way to stop this.
That wreck was your fault Kevin but you didn't start it. All you guys that jumped the start need to take a hand in this. 4 wide in row 3 before the green flag, come on! Yes the starter should have waved it off. But you all know better. All that did was make turn one more crowded than it should have been.
For all the cars that then passed me under the flashing yellow lights at the top of the hill, the stewards and I agreed to have a drivers meeting for our group instead of me filing paper on all ( and we knew who they are) then what happens? nobody shows up! That won't happen again.
As far as Sundays wave-off at the start does anyone Know why? I do. I don't care if we have to get waved off for the whole 14 laps we are going to do it right. Actually I do care but I'd rather do that than see my friends be put in an ambulance.
We are suppose to be doing this for fun. The track time is very minimal for 2 days of being at the track. The rest of the time should not have to be spent fixing damage, or arguing or seeing people in the hospital. At least this is not why I'm there.
We all need to look within ourselves and find our talent limitations and work on not exceeding them. Remember, racing is a high speed chess match. How many of you that play chess make your move first and then think about it?
Others just need to buy a bigger helmet because apparently the one you are wearing is cutting off the blood to your brain.

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Charlie Campbell
Race Engineering
carbotech brakes

BK Verified Driver
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Region: MoHud
Car #: 20
Year : 1992
Posts: 41
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I would like to thank everyone who has called and emailed to make sure I am all right. It really shows what a close knit community the SCCA race group is. I am fine but I consider myself very lucky because that was a very hard hit sliding sideways into the armco and would like to thank the EMT's and the hospital staff for the super care I received.

Adam - A special thank you for getting my wife to the hospital and staying with her.

I have looked at all the videos and it is clear to me that the one thing that some of us really seem to forget is that we are obligated to give our fellow racer adequate racing room so that car to car contact like the one that happened this weekend doesn't happen. We have to remember that there is no $100,000 purse at the finish line and there are no screaming fans in the stand waiting for the next big wreck to happen. We are racing with our friends and our families for the fun and personal satisfaction that we are able to participate in a sport that most people will only dream of doing. I have watched my sons get better every year because they work on their driving skills and perfecting their racecraft and not by putting the lastest Pro Head on their car or the hottest gas or the next greatest thing to make your "SPEC" Miata go fast. My son Bob has the same motor he has had 3 years ago when he ran consistent midpack and now runs consistant top 5 by ONLY being a smooth, knowledgable, head's up race driver. This is why we started racing SM because of the idealism of the "Spec" Series. It is to bad for the majority of us that this series didn't stay spec but we all know that is a whole differant subject.


We all need to take a step back and remember that we do this for "Fun" and not leave each race weekend with a half a dozen wrecked Miata's and a lot of memories of a bad weekend we thought was going to be fun and exciting. When you are out on the race track and you are setting up a low percentage pass or are going to try to put your racecar between two cars when there is no room and you are praying that the cars just open up for you, you might want to think of the video you have seen here and realize the damage and destruction that may happen by poor judgement and bad decisions.

Again I want to thank every one for their best wishes and hope to see everyone at the track soon.

Bob Karl

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BK Motorsports #20

racinglawyer Verified Driver
Old Member

Region: NEPA
Car #: 0
Year : 1997
Posts: 343
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quote:
Originally posted by disquek:
In 2006 the same person made the same move with the same result.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ga21CsLJ-Sc

-Kyle

If this is so then you have every right to be upset...What upset me was seeing the havoc and the track blocked requiring me to stop dead as the cars were still bouncing off each other. I could have said the "heck" with it and barged through...but I care deeply about each of you and to hurt someone is something I don't want to ever happen...I am still uploading my video to see if there is anything worth sharing that is meaningful.

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BE SAFE GO FAST HAVE FUN
Love "the commander" Mike Cefalo

JIM46
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Region: MOHUD
Car #: 46
Year : 1995
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T.J. funny take brother. On a positive note, I had a blast running with everyone in SSM this past weekend. BE YOUR BROTHERS KEEPER. Just a thought for a new class for repeat offenders, Smash Miata. Put them on the track all at the same time and the last one standing wins the hardware. All the parts and pieces that the clean up crew picks up.

seriously it is great to hear from you BK. I'm glad your doing better.
We should all listen to BK, he summed it up pretty good.

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JIMSSM46/MOHUD
Planet Miata

edzeb
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Region: Glen
Car #: #72
Year : 1990/1991/1992
Posts: 316
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All,

I am all for self governing. But who will administer it? Who will organize? Who will set up meetings, talks, interviews? This entire club is made up of volunteers. Volunteers who do work. Someone has to step up to the plate and do the work so we can race. I look up to anyone willing to do a job, even if they are not what some may think as the 'best'.
Don't like the announcer? Please offer up a person (or yourself even better yet) to do so. Don't like the party? Offer up to be the social chair of the event? Don't like the weather? Volunteer to be the Weather Steward.
What I am saying is that everyone here has as much power and authority to make change as anyone else. Get in involved. I have said this in the past, but do I like being RE, NA, CDI, and RC? Uhmmm. NO. But someone has to do the work. I did not run the Glen National because I was Co-Race Chair. I worked so others could race. Be willing to 'give back' to make it better for all.
If that includes heading up a divisional level SM/SSM driver's group to self police and make suggestions to the stewards & Licensing, I am all for it.

Speaking as RE, there are many more expenses and financial considerations that just track rental when it comes to hosting a Double or a Single. Be a RC and find out.

BK, I am so glad you are all right.

--Ed...

disquek Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Region: New England
Car #: 92
Posts: 1993
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The self policing idea, although a good one, has been tried and it failed. Talk to Serge Lentz (another NEDIV EX-SM guy). He tried very hard to make it work.

Why did it fail? Because the people in SM didn't care enough to volunteer or to show up.

How about before we try to re-write the system, we try to use the current one and see if it works.

Who wrote paper this weekend at WGI? Why not? What on earth would have prevented you from writing paper? By not protesting your sending the message to both the offender and to the stewards that you don't care.

Don't toss accountability for this onto the stewards. That's just not how the SCCA works. If you want stewards that get involved, try IMSA. It sucks, but it is what it is. You knew this when you stepped into the truck to tow out to Watkins Glen.

Bottom line, self policing is the only way, but the method of self policing is writing paper.

If I were still in SM and anyone touched my car for any reason at any point, I'd throw paper. It sends the signal that I care. I know ... "lighten up Francis".

At the WGI National at least five SMers came over to me and told me how lucky I am to not be in SM anymore. It's not luck.

As I've said before, this is 100% of the reason I left SM (and I'm so glad that I did).


Want to run with a group of people that respect each other on and off the track? Sell the SM, buy a prod car or better yet a GTL and come run in national small bore. This crap is not tolerated there.

Great prod and GTL cars can be had for pennies on the dollar. There are awesome cars for sale right now in the NEDIV that would cost around $100k to develop that can be bought for $15k. With the economy the way it is, these cars are at an all time low price. I'm not going to tell you that they're less work and less money. They're not. But with the lack of bodywork, I'm guessing it's about even.

GTLs are like little trans-am cars. Full tube frame, composite bodywork, dry sump, super close ratio dog box, quick change rear, high tech shocks, bias ply slicks (so awesome), light (1680 lbs w/o driver), agile, and ... the SIR is a great thing. It allows the motors to last way longer (about 2 seasons) and helps to provide parity. These are not the GT4/5 of old with hand grenade motors. A top SM pro motor is soft after two seasons too.

Unless you're Kevin .... then there are no good prod or GTL cars for sale anywhere ... ever.

Kyle

JIM46
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Region: MOHUD
Car #: 46
Year : 1995
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Ed no disrespect. You and everyone involved do a great job. Thanks to all the volunteers who give so much of their time.

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JIMSSM46/MOHUD
Planet Miata

Waterboy Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
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Region: WDC
Car #: 15
Year : 1995
Posts: 314
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quote:
Originally posted by edzeb:
Help the Stewards, if someone has to get the message, relearn, or just GO, THROW PAPER at them.
--Ed...

This is a joke right? I tried that at the National and it got me a reprimand.

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Tim Jacobs
Montgomery Irrigation

Weekend Warrior Verified Driver Made Donation to Website
Racing to Cure ALS (Lou Gehrig's Disease)

Region: WDCR
Car #: 56 "Earl"
Year : 1990, 1999 soon to be SM
Posts: 2947
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Who was in the White car? Just curious...

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http://www.olsinvestfinancial.com
http://www.alsinfo.org
http://www.weekendwarriorracing.com

Vick Verified Driver
Do they sell spec training wheels?

Region: NYR
Car #: 12
Year : 1991
Posts: 620
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The white car with blue and red stripes and stars involved in the incident is BK.

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http://www.volko.com

CP Verified Driver
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Region: NER
Car #: 7
Year : 1999
Posts: 636
Status: Offline
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I been trying to think of what to write and how to say it to you Kevin, but in the end I think you'll just brush it off anyway so I'll keep it short.

Your driving scares us and I have been trying all season to stay as far away from you as possible, plain and simple. Same goes for my seven LTD Racing teammates. Have you noticed the qualifying point-bys I've given you from 500 yards ahead? You drive too aggressively, don't respect the space of other cars around you, don't look out for the safety of your fellow competitors and don't give an inch if one is needed to safely get through a corner with other cars next to you.

I've had a great time racing lots of people this season side by side, knowing that they'll race me clean, give me racing room if needed and won't knock me out of the way to get by. I try my best to race the same way. I become fearful for my safety and the health of my car whenever you're around me on track. That's no fun at all and I know I'm not the only one in our region that feels this way.

Your name has come up in casual conversations more than I'd like to admit. Just two weeks ago someone said that it would only be a matter of time before you sent someone to the hospital by driving the way that you do. Well, it didn't take you long to prove that person correct unfortunately. I resent you for wrecking my car and putting my life directly at risk for no reason, as well as more than half of the field because of your boneheaded move before the 2nd corner on the first lap of a non-points qualifying race.

Tone it down a notch or three. Think of your wife and kids when you're out there. They want you to finish a race safely and probably don't care where you finish. I'll continue to race you with the respect that I to give all of our competitors, no worries there. Please clean up your racing and maybe you'll begin to gain some repect from your fellow racers in the future. Until then we'll try not to get tangled up in your mess. We're a family and should treat each other as such. Right now you're the red-headed stepchild.

To refresh your memory on my comments from two weeks ago: I told you what I thought of your driving after watching you run a teammate of mine off the track. I didn't mention anything about my spin, ie I didn't blame you for anything that happened to me. Better judgement dictated that I abort my pass attempt to go 3 wide into T3 with you in the middle and I got tagged for it because I didn't see Phil in my mirror. Get your facts straight and your hearing checked.

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-Cy
Supported by LTD Racing & Speed Shack - New England's Premier Auto Accessory Store
Rt1 AutoMile - Norwood, MA
http://www.speedshackonline.com

Andy Bettencourt Verified Driver
www.flatout-motorsports.com

Region: NER
Car #: 09 ITA
Year : 90, 91, 94 Rentals
Posts: 1109
Status: Offline
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I really think this needs to be a joint effort between the stewards and the drivers. When a crash like this happens, the drivers involved (if possible) should be called in front of the stewards. A proactive review of the incident should happen.

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Andy Bettencourt
Flatout Motorsports
www.flatout-motorsports.com

 
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